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[–]jesszillaa 7836 points7837 points  (1098 children)

The article states- “Johnson & Johnson has not marketed opioids in the U.S. since 2015 and fully discontinued the business in 2020.” So.. not really news

[–]fapsandnaps 799 points800 points  (52 children)

Honestly I'm surprised it was that. Reading the headline I expected to eventually see something like they stopped selling in Alaska so technically selling to the other 49 states isn't nationwide.

[–]gariant 337 points338 points  (34 children)

Generics probably took the value out of it.

[–]ExternalGrade 115 points116 points  (28 children)

Probably a good thing for this to happen as generics have less political push as compared to large pharma so in the long run assuming there is more push/awareness from the general public things could get better. But how do I know I’m just bsing.

[–]ExistentialAardvark 108 points109 points  (11 children)

Hi, I’m John J. Johnson Jr. III, and I’d like to offer you a position as the head of our PR department.

[–]TheGurw 40 points41 points  (1 child)

Only if I get to call you Johnsonsonson.

[–]MoHeeKhan 185 points186 points  (57 children)

Nationwide. Nationwide.

So what third world country have they turned this business on instead?

[–]gremalkinn 88 points89 points  (2 children)

Exactly... They're just taking their business where the laws aren't as strict as they are in the u.s. now.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Yes and the tobacco industry is a great example of that. Tobacco companies in the US market boast about efforts they make to curb underage smoking and try to appear ethical in the way they run things but then those same companies literally host big festivals in Asian countries where the cigarettes are the guests of honor. There are hot girls in hot outfits handing out free cigarettes to anyone that wants them at the festival. The streets in those places are lined with billboards and other ads targeting young people. It's disgusting.

These pharmaceutical, tobacco and most other corporations behave as badly as they are allowed to. They don't take the initiative to do right or do more than what is expected of them. Either their hands are tied due to laws and regulations so they behave better because of it or the unregulated behavior ends up hurting their bottom line so they stop. It is great what J&J has done regarding this article because it keeps the average person safer but I hope most people understand that they still don't give a shit about people.

[–]Barbuckles 42 points43 points  (3 children)

And they made billions.

[–][deleted] 324 points325 points  (505 children)

Pure political garbage.

[–]In__The__Ether 2172 points2173 points  (177 children)

Absolute insanity. First they were flooding the hospital with opioids and here we are now where you have to fight with your doctor to get them when you actually need them. Is it too much to ask that we don’t hard turn every time.

[–]zakpakt 762 points763 points  (110 children)

They majorly fucked up by over prescribing and equally fucked up by going full stop and fucking people over who actually need pain relief. Where do you think these people went when they stopped getting opioids from doctors? They added fuel to the fire that is the opioid problem, since these people turned buying from the streets.

[–]akm215 184 points185 points  (8 children)

Apparently, it is With everything in the US

[–]Trundle-theGr8 176 points177 points  (4 children)

The pendulum just fucking yeets to and fro around here

[–]Jaruut 9 points10 points  (0 children)

More of a propeller, really

[–]themagicflutist 69 points70 points  (4 children)

Future headline: opioid epidemic “solved”: new suicide epidemic concern of the century

[–]WoodsColt 22 points23 points  (3 children)

But first.... street heroin epidemic increases.

[–]limpchimpblimp 6410 points6411 points  (2152 children)

What are people who have acute pain going to get now?

[–]jormugandr 3714 points3715 points  (1044 children)

There are still dozens of companies that manufacture opioids.

[–]JeromesNiece 2244 points2245 points  (1012 children)

So what is the point of J&J not selling them?

[–]hoxxxxx 4703 points4704 points  (938 children)

it's a hollow victory that politicians and prosecutors can tout as a win

[–]Blackadder_ 698 points699 points  (162 children)

Also there’s this notion of Supply-side containment. Hasn’t worked with war on drugs nor will it work here.

We need to work on mental health along with liberalization of non-lethal drugs like marijuana. If you restrict it, there’s more drive to do it more.

[–]oleboogerhays 229 points230 points  (49 children)

Kentucky was experiencing the opioid epidemic many years before it was a national thing. Back in the late 00s kentucky started doing various things in an attempt to make opioids harder to obtain or harder to get high off of. The result was that heroin replaced the pills.

[–]PacificSquall 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Portugal had a huge heroine problem in the 90s so in 2001 they decriminalized all drugs and began putting that money in rehabilitation. it worked.

[–]Beo1 67 points68 points  (27 children)

And the annual death toll has increased by, what, a factor of 5 or so since? How’s that working out? Let people have their fucking pain pills.

[–][deleted] 117 points118 points  (5 children)

It's very clear that jailing people for possession and shaming them while targeting drug companies is just going about it ass-backwards.

[–]soline 1841 points1842 points  (734 children)

The real issue is in the US. We have the highest rate of opioid abuse and it has more to do with despair than access. People use it as an escape. Look at where it is used to most. A higher minimum wage would do more to curb opioid abuse than any company stopping the manufacture of opioid products.

[–][deleted] 90 points91 points  (12 children)

Also, adopting the Portugal approach to drug abuse would help a lot.

[–]jimdesroches 62 points63 points  (4 children)

Ya but they only have 20 years of successful data proving it works. Lol

[–]TheFuzziestDumpling 26 points27 points  (0 children)

Wow, I was curious and it's actually coming up on exactly 20 years. Decrim went into effect July 2001.

[–]poop_on_balls 54 points55 points  (1 child)

This is the answer. Stop the drug war.

[–]tehmlem 71 points72 points  (1 child)

They're a company with a track record of knowing participation in the diversion of drugs. They're agreeing to stop because they abused the ability to sell them.

[–]PeregrineFaulkner 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Yeah, with raw materials primarily supplied by J&J.

[–]PenguinSunday 178 points179 points  (88 children)

Person in acute and chronic pain here. We get nothing. We have gotten nothing since the beginning of opioid restrictions from the CDC.

[–]Raven_Skyhawk 41 points42 points  (7 children)

It sucked seeing the increasing hoops my dad had to jump through to get his chronic pain meds. I miss him so much now that he is gone but I was always worried that his medications for pain would keep getting controlled and restricted to a point that would leave him in even more pain. And I don’t think even medical weed will be here in NC anytime soon.

[–]Yotsubato 116 points117 points  (64 children)

The patients are the real loser here. I’m a doctor and yes the opiate pandemic is a huge problem. No banning medications that have real medical value is not the solution.

Educating patients and physicians is the solution.

Opiates are a tool, and a powerful one that could be misused. But for stuff like chronic and acute pancreatitis there’s not any other option that works.

Using them for back pain and osteoarthritis and stuff is a bad idea though.

[–]GATA6 36 points37 points  (2 children)

Yeah it hard. I work in Ortho and people always want oxycodone for knee osteoarthritis. They get so frustrated when I tell them that's not the treatment for osteoarthritis. There are injections, non narcotic medications, and surgery. A healthy 55 year old with knee osteoarthritis should never be treated with narcotics. Just get it fixed with the surgery. If they don't surgery that's fine but long term narcotics is not the treatment

[–]MultiStratz 302 points303 points  (110 children)

A doctor who tells them to just "walk it off".

[–]respeckKnuckles 163 points164 points  (85 children)

After 6 months waiting for an appointment, a two hour wait in the lobby, and 3 minutes actually spent with the doctor?

[–]Iagospeare 83 points84 points  (2 children)

And a $1,000 bill

[–]ColourofYourEnergy 56 points57 points  (36 children)

You get 3 minutes? I get maybe 2 with the assistant and then at the end of the day the Dr. sends all the prescriptions he signs off on through their computer system. I only met “my” doctor when I was about to drop dead from a lack of red blood cells and he told me to go straight to the ER after seeing my test results. Before that he said I was just tired all the time because I must be depressed. Funny how I was actually very sick and needed two blood transfusions and a three day hospital stay.

[–]hoxxxxx 129 points130 points  (35 children)

one of the dumber things i've read on here from people that think universal healthcare is a bad idea is that it takes months to get an appointment, especially at specialists, in countries that already have universal healthcare.

...yeah it's already like that, in my experience anyway.

[–]kkaavvbb 41 points42 points  (27 children)

lol my kid broke her wrist last week, and while trying to schedule an appmt with an orthopedic doc, the best they could give me was an appmt a month away.

I had to stress the importance of a 7 year old with a double fracture needed to see an orthopedic as she had just broken her wrist and needed to be seen ASAP. After some ridiculousness (on my end), I got an appmt few days later of them “squeezing her in the schedule.”

Like … really? I wouldn’t be calling for an appmt if it wasn’t absolutely necessary at the moment.

[–]hoxxxxx 21 points22 points  (3 children)

i can't imagine how badly backed up many doctors offices are right now due to a year of COVID fucking with literally everything from supply chains to shutdowns.

i've just been praying that myself and the people i'm close to don't have an accident like your child did, i'm sorry that happened but looks like it'll work out okay

[–]Atheren 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Not to mention I've been hearing from healthcare workers that I know, that a lot of their colleagues are severely burnt out and actually leaving the industry.

[–]GATA6 8 points9 points  (0 children)

That sucks. I work in ortho and always try to leave a couple spots open for add ons on ortho across the board is PACKED. People who avoided care for covid, everything opening back up (ton of sports injuries, people getting hurt at gym because they haven't been in a year, etc.).

Right now my earliest appointment available is like 4 weeks away. In cases like you describe it really is trying our hardest to "squeeze them in" and then patients complain about the wait. Right now I'm seeing 30+ patients a day and it's hard to get people in and then if we do yeah it's gonna be a wait.

Definitely agree that she needed to be seen quicker than a month but it is extremely extremely backed up even with most people working above typical schedules

[–]Feroshnikop 1125 points1126 points  (42 children)

Another slap on the wrist for Corporate America.

[–]AThiker05 428 points429 points  (34 children)

seriously. 230 million is a quarterly profit for one of their products.

[–]Phil_Late_Gio 188 points189 points  (30 children)

To be fair, they only make the raw ingredient. JnJ does not distribute opioids to pharmacies; they sell the opioid to other pharmaceutical companies.

JNJ is not implicated in any kick backs or illegal sales practices; that’s Purdue who sources their opioids from JnJ.

[–]CompetitiveNoise3244 31 points32 points  (3 children)

My grandfather got to where he couldn’t get his pain meds despite being 50-60 years old with several shoulder and hip surgeries. The man was always in pain, on the Vicodin or OxyContin he could atleast walk to his garden or ride his lawn mower/ side beside around the farm and enjoy life. When they cut him off all he could do was sit in his chair I hated hearing him grown just trying to stand up so he could go to the bathroom or kitchen.

The opioid crisis was terrible but so is the fact there are people living in agony because they cannot get their medication.

[–]Here_2utopia 198 points199 points  (5 children)

This isn’t the victory people think it is.

[–]lowlyinvestor 52 points53 points  (15 children)

I get that opioids we’re over prescribed leading to the crisis, but this backlash is bound to mean that people with chronic pain are going to see their access to the drugs get more difficult.

To put it in perspective, I had a friend pass away from bone cancer a few years ago. He walked into the hospital in agony and was immediately put in hospice. The last thing he wanted to do was to spend his final days in hospice so he went home under their care. A nurse would come to his house every 4-6 hours to administer his pain meds. Whatever they were giving, the dose needed to be higher, not more often just higher. But they wouldn’t increase his Doses any further unless he agreed to come inpatient. It’s not like he was asking to keep drugs under his control or anything. I went to visit him during all this, he was In agony and again just didn’t want to be in patient waiting to die. He held out as long as he could, finally went in patient the night before he passed away.

So yeah, after seeing that I wished there was a way I could advocate for people in acute and chronic pain. It seemed stupid as hell that the nurse administering meds couldn’t just give him more when there was no threat of diversion at all. But that word popped into the conversation none the less.

[–]SlothChunks 20 points21 points  (9 children)

Exactly. I am one of those people. My conditions are extremely serious. Chronic back pain that was made worse by cancer treatments. I do get opioids but the doctors don’t want to ever increase the small amount I get despite my condition only getting worse which is all documented by them. My condition is incurable. I also know other people from the hospital support group. They are either seniors over 70 or people who got nightmarish pain from cancer. We all have been enduring the behavior of doctors which started suddenly to dismiss our pleas for help. Not like asking “give me more” but asking for any options. They straight up say “well, we don’t have any more options for you”

[–]lowlyinvestor 9 points10 points  (3 children)

I'm very sorry you have to go through that. I get that they were over abundant before. That was because high school footballers would dislocated an elbow and get a months worth of oxycodone, which inevitably would be abused by them and their friends. Now my fear is that were' swinging too far in the other direction. Yes, this news is "only" about JNJ, but Purdue is already gone, there will be a next one and a next one and another after that, I'm sure. And everyone will keep applauding it until they end up in a predicament where they need them and they aren't available anymore.

[–]MsMeseeksTellsTime 127 points128 points  (22 children)

Yeah. People who live with severe, chronic pain really appreciate it.

[–]317LaVieLover 38 points39 points  (0 children)

yeahhhh that’ll work just peachy.

Alert to the cartels and China: you’re about to gain a few hundred thousand new fent customers!! Funeral homes: you’re about to gain a few hundred thousand new dead-from-fent customers!!

[–]PettyBettyismynameO 51 points52 points  (10 children)

And this kinda crap is why after my second traumatic caesarean I was given 5 pain pills and told “good luck” I almost killed myself between the pain trying to nurse and the pp anxiety and depression

[–]gosell1 35 points36 points  (1 child)

Headline: Johnson and Johnson enters New York Marijuana industry

[–][deleted] 222 points223 points  (43 children)

There is a guy I met at the VA whose mother uses heroin for her chronic pain. She's in her 80's. Why? Because it is cheaper for her. This is another example of how our society punishes everyone for the crimes of a few.

[–]dhoae 44 points45 points  (11 children)

This isn’t as good as it seems. People legitimately need their pain relief and before anyone tries to push weed or whatever it’s not strong enough for some people. The problem with opioids wasn’t their existence, it’s how they were pushed unnecessarily. They need to be used responsibly just like every other drug.

[–]ComradeCunt18 32 points33 points  (2 children)

One of my biggest fears us that America will pull an Iran and just make all opiods illegal, or at least regulate them in such a way that pharma companies will no longer bother. Opiods should be controlled, but they are a medical necessity, especially for end of life care.

[–]Tendytatercasserole 528 points529 points  (60 children)

I hate when knee jerk is to stop all vs. Tighten rules to stop those abusing it

[–]omgcatss 33 points34 points  (1 child)

From reading the article it sounds like it was J&J’s choice to stop selling opiates, as it’s no longer good for their bottom line or their public image. The New York state ruling said that they cannot promote/advertise opiates or lobby on behalf of opiates. They are still allowed to manufacture and sell them.

[–]succed32 205 points206 points  (43 children)

The pharmaceutical companies are the ones abusing it.

[–]peterkeats 42 points43 points  (1 child)

It’s not a stop-all. A lot of companies sell opioid based pain relief. J&J has just proven to be too irresponsible to be one of those companies.

[–]143019 67 points68 points  (23 children)

This terrifies me. I have worked with so many people with intractable pain and Gabapentin doesn’t cut it.

[–]Ott621 9 points10 points  (9 children)

Is there a condition they don't prescribe gabapentin for?? I've been prescribed for like three different reasons before

[–]143019 16 points17 points  (6 children)

My ex-husband was a doctor/toxicologist and he told me that they always joke that Gabapentin does haven’t any side effect, mostly because it doesn’t have any effects at all.

[–]CreatrixAnima 12 points13 points  (1 child)

How is this going to affect people who really need them? Like cancer patients and people who are really in horrible pain? I get that we need to control the abuse of these drugs, but… What do we do with the really sick people?

[–]fightercammytoe 104 points105 points  (17 children)

This whole thing just punishes patients who need pain control. It makes it stupidly hard just to get a stupid prescription for these things, which is what could push people for street opiods anyway. Not everyone is an opiod addict, and some patients do legitimately need pain control. A lot of these are obtained on the street anyway. Like the government cares about "protecting people" anyway. Not to mention, some pain patients are driven to suicide with no care.

This stupid posturing shit should piss anyone off, including doctors.

[–]Avestrial 318 points319 points  (63 children)

Sorry that this is not really relevant but I am just struck by the sentence “the opioid crisis that has killed 500,000 people since 1999” and how we accept this as a real crisis pretty readily for the most part and that COVID has killed far greater than that number in a fraction of the time. Shit’s fucked. My family has been touched by both crises . Just ugh. Sorry.

[–]Khatib 99 points100 points  (19 children)

There's a LOT more lives ruined by opioids than just the ones registered as dying from them. An addiction epidemic isn't just measured by the number of dead.

You're still not wrong about half the country woefully underestimating the seriousness of covid though.

[–]brycedriesenga 40 points41 points  (12 children)

Definitely, but covid doesn't only kill people either. Lots of long haulers out there, not to mention possible effects we just don't know about yet.

[–]thekarmabum 50 points51 points  (1 child)

This is a slippery slope, because opioids have a medical use. The problem is people abusing them. They probably did over prescribe them, and encourage doctors to do it, but when you come out of surgery you really kinda need that shit.

[–]Wilgrove 18 points19 points  (3 children)

All this is going to do is hurt people who legit need opioids to function and lead a normal life. The addicts will move to street drugs or buy their Oxy from the street corner. This move solves nothing!

[–]dildoswaggins8008135 54 points55 points  (7 children)

Message to pain management patients : go fuck yourself.

[–]akm215 25 points26 points  (5 children)

How about we legalize all of these drugs and spend the taxes on letting people go to effective rehab centers. This way the people who use drugs recreationally can and we don’t stigmatize and lock people up for a mental health issue. Sincerely, an ex heroin addict who’s 6 years clean

[–]repost__defender 24 points25 points  (2 children)

Why is J&J under the gun so much, and Pfizer is off the hook for the exact same things?

[–]LazyBox2303 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I am one of the chronic pain sufferers who only can get daily relief from nerve pain with Norco or its generic. I have taken a half pill twice a day or when the pain begins. I’ve done this for at least ten years. I never need to have more than this and am so glad my doctor prescribes it for me. He knows I don’t abuse any drugs he gives me.

[–]mshriver2 43 points44 points  (3 children)

Wow just terrible. Taking the pain meds away from people who truly need them. "Sorry you have to live your life in pain because some people got high."