There is an H.G. Wells story that deals with exactly this sort of situation. He called it "The Mysterious Island," but it's more commonly known as "The Island of Dr. Moreau." I've never gotten the impression it's meant as a utopia.

I work with someone who identifies as a furry. Unfortunately, he does so within five minutes of meeting him. After that, what's interesting about him is a steep dropoff.

Wow. This is pretty awesome. Though I haven't yet watched it, will do so at first opportunity.

Honestly we all (*cough* the furries, that is) think that SOMEONE here at BB is a furry. Prolly Xeni. (Yeah, we know you've said it creeps you out, but come on now, any furry says that if they're in the furry 'closet' you know.) Or possibly Cory since there's a furry character in Down and Out... or that could just be crazy theories :)

In any event, I'm pretty sure at least a fair amount of furries read BoingBoing so it's nice to see the coverage, even if the *other* BB readers are left a bit clueless :)

And @License Farm: Unfortunately being a furry does not make you interesting or cool. However, it doesn't prevent you from being interesting or cool, either. And people who tell EVERYONE they know (including co-workers, random people they meet) right off the bat like that probably has a 'furry pride' complex. You know, if they don't make it known to everybody, they're not properly showing their uh, furry spirit?

I would say that there's just a latent element in the human psyche that enjoys dressing up and separating itself from reality.

There are all kinds of groups from costuming groups like the 501st Legion, to furries, to klingons, to civil war re-enactors to ren-faire folk and more. All of them seem to get some enjoyment of the escape from reality and putting on another, some would say truer, persona.

Yes, sometimes people get carried away, some people define their lives by their freakiness, but that's ok. Most people define their lives by their normalcy, and that's boring.

My testicles look like Klingons doing Tribble cos-play. Does that count for anything?

Perhaps! I am rather into fake fur coats. Fur-curious, I guess!

Perhaps I'm stating the obvious, but it seems like I'm seeing a group of unattractive and introverted people that feel more comfortable when they're hidden behind a mask.

If you can't interact with people without a costume, there is something wrong with. Get some help for your self esteem, and maybe a gym membership.

I would say that there's just a latent element in the human psyche that enjoys dressing up and separating itself from reality.

Yeah, it's what inspires me to act.

@TK: Naturalists might diss you similarly for wearing pants.

Apologies in advance for a critical post. I'm a long time reader of boingboing and was very excited about the bbTV launch but the last couple episodes have been disappointing after what seemed like a promising start.

I think BBTV works better with the brief talking heads to break things up. It gives the show a more consistent personality and makes me feel less like I'm just watching a spoon fed YouTube clip.

There needs to be some distinct difference between the bb posts that link to an episode of bbTV and the bb posts that link to a video of a guy levitating. Maybe the production timeline is too ambitious? Could bbTV be scaled back to two days a week or one day a week and have higher production value? Maybe I just need to look at it as a vlog instead of a mini show.

I'm also not sure how others feel about this but it seems like a sell out move to endorse what looks like a poorly made IT crowd knock off. I'm not even clear on if it's a real show or some advertisement scheme cooked up by a big company along the lines of the createsimplicity adverts.

I think bbTV should probably be more discerning about their endorsements if they're going to ask viewers to sit through a commercial.

Just some thoughts I wanted to share. Good luck with the show.

@Pat Race: Thanks for watching and caring enough about it to respond!

* I AM WEARING PANTS.

* re: format of this episode, we're experimenting with a lot of different things here. Today's episode was not pre-fab, not something we just grabbed off YouTube and re-ran on BBtv. The process was kind of cool -- the filmmaker provided us with access to tons of raw material from the film she's still making. Our (disgustingly talented) editor picked little bits here and there with which to tell a story in less than 5 minutes on the internet, and strung it all together. We actually did tape some host intros, but when our editors showed us what they'd constructed -- I dunno, we just all felt like this story told itself better without any interruption from us. Maybe we'll do it differently next time. Whatever. The beauty of this experiment is that it's just that: a daily experiment. We promise you that this will never be homogenous, or a copout. We promise you that we will try new things every day. And yeah, we're gonna keep doing it every day.

* That said: Expect more of our faces and voices (Mark, me, other Boingers) in the mix next week, though, we've been roaming around the world shooting a bunch of adventures this week... editing now.

* re: IT ROOM. We get paid to run ads, and that's what enables us to produce the show. We know Dell is ethical and makes good computers and monitors -- they like this campaign, our viewers have been sharing their opinions about it, and I'll be interested to see how that develops.

* WHEN FURRIES LOOK AT US, THEY SEE FOOD.

As one of the people featured in this documentary I think you might find it interesting that the last portion may need a little explanation.

I build costumes professionally now. I used to be an IT guy in the soulless corporate machine. Sadly I wish the documentary was being shot today as I have lost 60pds since. I am a happier person and no longer supplement my happiness with food.

But more to the point, the masks I create some have night vision or thermal imaging systems in them. And amplified hearing / ultrasonic conversion into the human hearing range. so you can actually hear into the ultrasonic range.

you can see more at lionofthesun.com

Lionel

TK (6), low self-esteem might explain body-covering clothing, but no way does it explains why people would make exuberant furperson costumes and wear them at social events.

Honestly, furries are no different than any other geeky subculture like sci-fi or anime. Perhaps I'm stating the obvious, but I think the folks throwing stones are the ones who have the real self-esteem issues.

Yeah, yeah, I know... furries are weird... but so what? There's nothing wrong with that. Heck, if we had more people who appreciated the cute and weird instead of holding up conformity as a virtue, the world would probably be a better place for it.

I mean, it just boggles the mind that folks (even on BoingBoing of all places!) try to one-up each other on proving how normal they are.

Ye gods, people.

Myself, I'm all about the cute and weird. I thrive on it. It's one of the main reasons I like sites like CuteOverload and BoingBoing. The people who get bent out of shape about furries aren't any different than the folks who thought D&D; was satanic back in the 1980s.

Years ago, I got to have dinner with Trace Beaulieu of MST3K fame, and someone asked what he thought of the folks who dump on furries. As it turns out, the inter-geek warfare really disappoints him. Then again, he was a sci-fi fan in his pre-MST3K years, so I guess he knows how it feels to get mocked for liking something other folks think is "weird."

The bottom line is how you react to furries says more about you than it does about furries. I'm sure there will always be people who hold anyone who strays from the beaten path up as a target for derision. And that's too bad, because they don't realize how much cool stuff they're missing out on in this big weird wonderful world of ours.

Furries serve a very useful purpose in geekdom.

Whenever you feel too geeky for being really into sci-fi or computers or comics you can look at the furries and say to yourself "I'm so glad I'm not a furry. Those furries are the worst possible nerds on the planet." Then suddenly you feel cool about your life because you're not a furry and that alone lifts your self-esteem.

Just think...this is the same emotional response the jocks felt in high school when they made fun of you and your D&D; books. You now know how they saw you. You looked like furry to their ignorant eyes.

Long live the furries. The geek food chain needs them.

I think one of the interviewees at the Furries vs. Trekkies bowling tournament about a month ago sums it up best:

"Anytime you can do anything that is alternative to the mainstream of reality, do it."

Thanks for the lengthy response Xeni, I did like the furry segment your editor cut together today and really admire your ability to stick to such an ambitious schedule. It's hard to do anything five days a week outside of eating and sleeping.

My criticism is meant to be purely constructive. I understand that the show is somewhat experimental and it's good that you're willing to defend your decisions. It shows that you've put thought into them.

You're a ridiculously talented bunch and I expect a lot of good things out of you.

@Pat, thanks! And @Lionel, WOW, thanks for commenting here. We're going to feature you, and your amazing creations, in part two of "American Furry" on BBtv, probably next week.

Hey, for everyone who thinks furries are uncool, check this out (work-safe):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1wnOUH2jk8

XJ

@B88
I am sorry that you (or other geeks, as I was unable to determine if you count yourself within their ranks) require other people (i.e. furries, klingons, whatever) to look down upon to feel good about your/themselves.

Furries, in general, are pretty happy with who THEY are without having to look at someone else and consider themselves superior.

However, most furries are glad they arn't "mundanes". That's what we should all really be afraid of being (every BB reader included!). For the purpose of this post, I'm broadening the definition of 'mundane' past 'non-furry'; it could also refer to people who are just simply mind-numbingly normal. Fate worse than death :)

PS: Xeni definitely has friends in the fandom (I'm pretty sure) :)

as a furry myself, There are some kickass people that the community attracts. I don't have a fursuit, or really participate in any of that, but it is still damm impressive to see the ammount of work that goes into making one.

The con this was filmed at (FC) plays host to furries, but lots of local artists, pupeteers (think: ILM and that crew) along with lots of people from the surrounding zoos and aquaruims that come and present panels. Its pretty damm cool running into the 'pros' that are drawn into the community.

The orca kid is creepy though. period. he is a great example of what furry is not about. Everyone at seaworld knows to avoid him and limit his access to animals, Luckily he is one of he few this is a problem with!

I am a furry myself, I'm not big on fursuiting and all to be honest though. In fact this vid was a little creepy to me, I don't understand how fursuiters like that kinda stuff, but I'm glad this seems to be be a step towards the right direction towards the ending of getting called a "fur fag" all the time.

To be honest though... all I am is a simple artist who picked up furry by searching online for Animorphs stuff, so what do I know?

#14 B88 appears to be channeling Lore Sjoberg's Geek Hierarchy:

The Geek Hierarchy

Some of my college friends were "anthropomorphic art fans" -- proto-furries I guess. When I ran into them in later years they took pains to note that fur suiters were a different crowd. So maybe there's a hierarchy thing going on there too.

great episode! feels like we're going beyond blogging & links & into little slices of strange and wonderful. faster! deeper! more!!!

This is interesting fur sure!

Wow. I noticed you haven't managed to interview a single furry that wasn't mentally unhinged, socially inept, or had an ego the size of a planet.

This whole project smells like yet another personal attack on a bunch of people who don't hurt anybody, who aren't trying to 'spread the gospel' and cram their beliefs down the throats of innocent bystanders, and who generally just want to be left alone.

Quite frankly I'm disappointed you couldn't even dig up at least one or two fat people to talk in excruciating detail about their sex life too.

Why is it always the fringe elements that are pulled into the spotlight when people do these "omg exposé of the furries!!11!" ?

Are normal furries just too boring? Are you afraid that viewers won't be sufficiently shocked and appalled if you show fursuiters that lead a normal, successful life?

The VAST majority of furries see the fandom as a hobby or an interest or a place to meet like-minded people. It's a tiny, tiny percentage that are so obsessed with spirituality that they think they're really lions or werewolves, or that they were a dragon in a previous life.
And I'll bet you anything that percentage is much smaller than the amount of non-furries who think they're aliens or have been abducted and impregnated by 'em.

It's such a typical media angle to take on the subject. "Oh golly gee, there's a group of people here and some of them are weirdoes!"
Yes, but that's true for any group of people in the entire world you care to mention. What's your point?

There's a grand total of THREE people in the fandom crazy enough to get furry tattoos on their faces and whiskers surgically implanted, and guess what.. furries think they're freaks too!

You people should be ashamed.

Furries are the geekiest of all geekdom? I think those Klingons are a bunch of freaks. I could never get into Star Trek like that. Same thing with the Jedis and Star Wars. Furry isn't based off of movies or pop culture or stuff like that. Furry goes back thousands of years when people would wear the remains of animals and tell stories about animal spirits and totems. But, today, it's a lifestyle. It's just what feels right, and no harm is being caused by it. In fact, it causes most people a lot of joy. And, despite the media, we are generally family friendly, and you don't have to hide it from your kids. It may seem strange to the average "mundane", but do a little research, and meet a few of us. It really isn't as strange as the media makes it out to be. It's also not as controversial. And, if you want to see how geeky furry can be, watch this video of a well-known fur simply having a little fun in the snow. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IDHcdsO4oM

@ #20 Anonymous:

Marianne Shaneen here- just wanted to clarify- almost all of the convention footage shown in this clip was from Califur, not FC (though I've been to FC several times and it's a really great con).

As for the furry you mentioned, I was not aware of anything you're referrring to- feel free to email me privately (at my website) if you wish.

TG: Those few are called "lifestyle furs", and I'm friends with a few, and many have other hobbies. For example, Aerofox is happily married to Loriana (who's also a lifestyler) and is also an enthusiast of antique radios. People just don't understand why someone would rather stay in character and be what they want to be than to just be what they were to begin with. I've thought many times that I'd rather be a fox, and I dream about it almost every night, but I don't really have a fursuit. A mismatched head and tail (different colored fur, and from different people) are all I have. I plan on getting a full fursuit in the near future. I love the idea! I am a dental assistant for a dentist who has been practicing pretty much my entire life, and if I had the chance, I'd wear a fursuit on my freetime, around the house, and out to places, perhaps.

I think it all comes down to a form of expression that doesn't involve mutilation or permanent marks on the body. It's enjoyable, and you can be something you're not.

Since I do not feel like making an account, on yet another website.. I am GoldAnthroWolf / TriGem.

Anyways..

As the poster in: #25 posted by TG , November 3, 2007 8:24 AM: pointed out, there are a vast number of relatively boring and mundane like furs, who just get into the whole scene, because it suits their particular interest. The whole nutcase or slightly unhinged fur, is all that the media latches onto, because it only serves to make a relatively lackluster fandom seem even more creepy.

Yes, like all 'fandoms/subcultures' you will have the morality challenged, the despots, and the flat out freaks. But, those are the ones that the majority of the public see, simply because they crave the limelight and seek to be camera whores and attention grabbers. These are the people who people like me despise, being a veteran of sorts of the fandom for over 15 years.

At one point I was guilty of being a 'Oh look at me' sort of person, but I realized that I did not need to draw attention to myself, even in my boring kinda life. I grew up, wised up, and realized that to make a positive statement about furry I simply needed to be me, a normal boring dude.

In a nutshell, if you want to see freaks, you see freaks, and they throw themselves on you... no matter what crazy sort of odd little corner of the net, or subculture you look for. But, as human beings we strive to find the odd, the weird, the meek and point fingers and laugh when they do not follow the majority.

Make a documentary about the people who do not dress up, who do not go prancing around like limp-wristed Care Bears, who do not have a computer filled with smut, or the like. Then, I bet you'd find yourself with the majority of the 'normal' fur crew, and you would not be able to find something to go 'eww freaks' about.

Peace out.

I am into furry, but only on an occational kink level. I completely agree that it is a geekfest. I'll socialize around once in awhile if I"m horny enough, but like many things, there are so many who take it to far. I've never met so many social rejects in one place, people who really need the mask to hide behind.

At least half of them anyways. But...there is another half, a kinky fun in a perverted kind of way crowd. People who are capable of actually holding a conversation without the word yiff. Dare I say it, there are actually downright datable furries ..... if you have a thing for perverts :)

errr. Furverts.

I know I do.

P.S. My costume's (fursuit) preferred habitat is Burningman, the black rock desert... and it looks like it belongs there. I am not a disney character.

By day, I am a jeans and a t-shirt industrial mechanic. In shape and built like a strategically shaved gorilla.

I hate stereotypes, despite how based on fact they are.

very interesting! being in the fandom (but not having the whole "we must accept everybody" mindset that a lot have) i see both a negative and a positive aspect. the positive being that it does allow some whom wouldn't normally be comfortable in everyday social situations don the mask that gives them the separation so that they can create the persona that they want to be "strong, confident, social, friendly... attractive?" that otherwise without, they wouldn't be looked at twice by a good deal of mainstream types (cliques.)

the negative, however is that since there's this general "all accepting" atmosphere, there is a lot more drama than normal and a lot of people in the fandom that aren't socially developed enough to interact positively in difficult situations. you'll get people turning hugs and such into shows of "deeper emotional connections" and become almost stalker-like. you'll get people that will go overboard (eg: someone saying "i'm a wolf, so i only eat meat... no vegetables here") completely ignoring the fact that they ARE still human... and that's just two examples. if you want to know more, just log onto a furry chat channel. i guarantee you'll see more examples of poor social skills eventually.

but, all things aside, like someone posted above. it's almost exactly like trekkies, ren-faire types, larp-ers except that the sexual side of it has been given more publicity (every subculture will have it's level of sexuality... we are human afterall)

now, saying this however doesn't mean that my own persona (a grey housecat) and myself aren't all accepting and naieve... hell no. i hold people up to the same rules that i would expect them to hold up to me. being a good person, being honest, being able to communicate (effectively ideally, but at least being able to communicate) and not going all emo-drama-queen which seems to be a trend nowadays.

@ #25 TG

Hi, TG, I’m the filmmaker- I appreciate your comments, and do want to hear from furs about what they think is a fair/unfair representation.

I do find it interesting that in apparent defense of furries, you manage to insult and judge a whole bunch of people whom you’ve never met as ‘mentally unhinged, socially inept”, etc.- because you (not the film) see them as ‘weirdos’ who don’t fit your definition of what constitutes a ‘normal furry’. That seems far closer to a ‘personal attack’ than anything depicted in the clip.

Not one of the people portrayed in this very short clip claimed to be a werewolf or lion in their past life (or in this life). While a couple of them do have strong spiritual connections to an animal, primarily what people in this clip talked about and expressed are their imaginations, creative ways of exploring aspects of themselves and being playful, and the importance of community.
One reason that the film is called “American Furry” is because the Furry fandom does include such a vast array of expression, belief systems, lifestyles, and in the film you will see a wide range represented from ‘run of the mill’ fans of anthropomorphic animals, to artists, to fursuiters and non-suiters, to people who are spiritual, to lifestylers- (and yes, the film also includes Stalking Cat who is on one end of the spectrum, and who is a furry with many friends who has a very interesting perspective and insights).

I agree, furries don’t harm anyone, and don’t cram their views down anyone’s throats. I’m not sure why you would assume that those shown in the 4-minute clip lead anything but ‘normal successful lives’- where exactly does the clip show that? This is an assumption that you’ve made about those depicted, based on a small glimpse you’ve seen of their interests. Obviously, a 4-minute clip is going to focus on really colorful moments and doesn’t show the whole story. Almost all of the furries I’ve interviewed- (and those in this clip!) actually DO have jobs, friends and lives, and are decent, extremely creative, very kind people.

For those in the film, the fandom is a positive, imaginative aspect of their lives giving friendship, support, enjoyment, fun, and a way to explore and express themselves - whether as a hobby or a lifestyle.

One interesting thing that TG’s comments demonstrate is that Furry is a microcosm- it includes a wide range of people from many different backgrounds and viewpoints. While I have found it to be incredibly tolerant and accepting as a whole, Furries are human- and the Furry fandom has its all-to-human culture wars, extremes, hierarchies, cliques, as well as judgments and disagreements about what is normal and acceptable.

-Marianne Shaneen

@32 Marianne Shaneen

GoldAnthroWolf / TriGem here... again..

Wow.. is all I have to say.

You know, it says something when the maker of the film stands up and defends furs when someone bashes them in an undo light.

Hoorah! :D

I thought the term was "plushie", and was featured in Trailer Park Boys as well as Law and Order.

www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=plushie

-Richard Walker

@32 Marianne Shaneen

There may be several comments, being posted to this article, that are not coming from furries at all. Your article was posted on several websites dedicated to spoofing furry fandom. I suspect comment #25 and #30 fall into this category. If you've been talking to furries, then you know that it is often lampooned for laughs. Some of it comes from outside furry fandom, but there are also several people, who are disenchanted with the fandom, that engage in this sort of activity. The impression I get, from furries I've talked to, is that not all of the lampooning is simple ribbing. Some of it is just mean spirited.

I find the topic of furries interesting. I've been part of the Sci/Fi fandom for many years. I've seen furry fandom grow from it's original roots in the Sci/Fi community and become it's own independent genre. Most furries are shy but usually friendly people. Many of them are very creative. I know several furries whom I count as very good friends.

Awesome video, I can't wait fir part 2.

As a response to @ShadowFox, I'm into fursuiting myself, but even I found that video pretty creepy.

@34: No, Law & Order (and Trailer Park Boys, and Urban Dictionary in turn) are incorrect.

A "plushie" refers to a plush animal.

A "plushophile" is someone who's very, um, fond of them.

Just so ya know.

Luca Shoal is my name, no registering for me.

Do another one of these...just none of the tiger guy, he's over played and a freak of nature. Many furrs think he's a dick, a jerk, and a freak.

Other than that... seems rather decent. Still, get rid of the tiger.

@32 Marianne Shaneen

Hey, I'm Torque.

Firstly, i'd like to thank you for standing up for furs with a very balanced argument, it's very rare to hear something like that from anyone outside the fandom.

It's hard to tell what is and what isn't an unfair representation in most short films about us, as the degree to which people follow the fandom varies a great amount. It is true however that most, if not all, documentaries i've seen about us do create a bit of an exaggeration about what the fandom is like as a whole.

I've been part of the fandom for about 5 years now, and i love it, though it's pretty much a second life for me which exists almost completely online.

Offline, i'm studying Biomedical Science at University, i've got loads of friends and my social life's getting a little too busy (it's pretty rare i have any free nights at the moment), yet NONE of my friends offline know that i'm a fur, not even my family knows about it yet.
Online, i've got loads more friends from all around the world; and even though i've never met most of them before, they're easily as good friends to me as those offline.

This is mainly because, from my experience within the fandom, i've found that furs are the most open, easy to talk to, and accepting group of people i know, which is why i like them so much.

Well, back to the video, it does show one of the extreme sides of the fandom, though as you explained earlier, it's obvious that the more 'colourful' aspects would be shown in a 4 minute documentary to keep it interesting. Just be careful though because it can (and does) create a strong stereotype which a lot of people use against us.
I don't own a fursuit (Though i'll admit i wouldn't mind getting one sometime), and i don't feel the need to go around using it as a means to "Express my primal urges" as your video suggests.

To me, it's just a second life where i can totally be myself, without having to worry about being judged for it.

I could write a lot more but this post's already longer than i intended so i'll leave it there. I look forward to seeing the following films as its always interesting to see how other furs see the fandom.

Thanks,

Torque

Wow, looks like you've attracted a lot of attention from the furry crowd, Ms. Shaneen. Anyways, I figured I'd put my two cents in as far as my own experiences.

I've been in the fandom a little over a year. Or for the past ten years. Whichever. I've always drawn anthropomorphic characters, although back when I was younger I didn't quite know that there was an actual fandom based on anthros. Admittedly, my first exposure to the fandom was through adult artworks, so I've always identified it with sexuality. It was also through this exposure that I began to accept that I'm gay. I didn't really "officially" join the fandom until around August of last year, and from there have found it developing into a much less sexual thing, and more as just a sort of... I dunno, something that just is ingrained within me, something that's a part of my persona and bleeds into everything I do in just the slightest degree.

I think that, for me at least, it's a form of escapism. In reality, I work at Taco Bell, still live with my mom, and don't even have the funds to go to college. Even if I did, the profession I'd like to follow would require that I move from the East coast to the West, and both my mother and sister have made it very clear through their actions that my mom would never survive if I left. It gives me a sense of being sucked into a downward spiral, so any chance to be something other than myself, I'll take. Don't get me wrong; I like being human. But I need to run away from myself sometimes. In a way, it's like Halloween every day. On Halloween, one gets to dress up as a pirate, or a ghost, or a murder victim, and for a few hours each year, they aren't what they were born as, but someone else. On that level, I understand fursuiting, because it turns you from what you are into what you want to be.

I'm actually a closet furry, to be honest. The reason for this is because of my mom and sister. Neither one is very accepting of anything not fitting into the mold of "normal." It was bad enough when I came out to them as gay, and my mom still tries to insist that I'd look good with a girl, and doesn't get that my attraction to men is more than just purely sexual. When my sister first had a clue of my being furry, she thought I was a zoophile, and still thinks that all furries are, and my mom insists that the whole lot of them are freaks based on what she saw on that famous CSI episode. It's opinions of that nature that need to be changed.

I will admit that the clips in the film seem to show the more extreme elements of the fandom. One thing that concerns me is that it could be cut in such a way that the fandom seems to be more sexualized than it is. Already the common conception of the furry fandom is that it's purely a sexual kink, akin to bondage or bestiality or the like. What I'd like to see more is the people in their everyday lives, outside their fursuits. It could also do to have more on those who don't live on the fringes of the fandom: those who don't fursuit, those who don't visit conventions, those who don't feel a "spiritual connection" to a certain species. As you and several others have mentioned, the clip does show the more "colorful" aspects, as it would have to to grab someone's attention. But I hope that the full documentary does contain more folks who see the fandom as more of a hobby than a permanent lifestyle.

Erm... well, that's about all I can think of to say. I'll be looking forward to seeing this, and hoping that it reveals the fandom to be just as normal as any other subculture as it seems you want to depict us as. Good luck with the film.

Furries are nothing spiritual, it is no better than a foot fetish. Nothing separates it from the other dark corners of the internet.

@ #24 #32

The only thing all furries have in common is an appreciation of anthropomorphic animals. Though united in their appreciation of these creatures of myth and imagination, what draws each furry to this interest and how they choose to express it is diverse and unique to each individual.

In a way, many furries are more accepting and tolerant of other people's beliefs and lifestyles than those with other interests out of necessity. With such diversity, it is impossible to find any belief or lifestyle that everyone has in common and without that acceptance and tolerance, it is impossible for furries to come together to explore their common interest with each other.

That being said though, there *are* many furries that aren't tollerant of certain other furries' and beliefs and lifestyles or how they choose to express themselves. Being a furry, in itself, does not require one to be tollerant and accepting of others.

I think those opinions, fortunately, or unfortunately, just don't get heard because these people either don't go to larger furry gatherings where they will be subjected to things they find objectionable, or if they do, don't express their intolerance there for fear of being rejected. It's hard to tell then, whether these people are a silent majority or their opinions are on the fringe.

It's understandable for people to be angry when others are misrepresenting them, but I don't see any malice being involved. Some individuals are telling their stories and a reporter is covering them.

If there is some grave missrepresentation being made, one would think there should be an overwhelming flood of objections rather than commendations, but their really isn't so perhaps that opinion is in the minority and their are many more that agree with the opinions expressed in the video.

@ #14 #18

I always seem to think people that need to put others down to feel good about themselves lack any positive qualities in themselves they could otherwise use to make themselves feel good about themselves.

Furries *do* things that make them feel good about themselves; they don't need to put others down.

Furries, unlike many other "geeks," actually create much of the material they're interested in themselves. The furry fandom is filled with writers, artists, costumers and performers. Rather than admire some fictional character someone else created, furries create their own and create their own stories around them.

No matter what people gather to do, whether it is Society for Creative Anachronisms, Historical Recreationists or religions, you will find some people take it to the lengths of making it a 24/7 lifestyle. Others will have varying levels of involvement.

I find the argument "they are all fat and ugly geeks with no self esteem" tend to come from people who lack understanding of what people get from having more in their life than the every day hum drum. It is easy to stereotype a group when you fail to see them as individuals.
That sort of critisism has historical roots which we can follow back through prejudice based on sexual orientation, race, religion etc. etc.

Some people can't feel good about themselves unless they have someone to hate, it spawned the Inquisition, the MCarthy era, witch trials, the deaths of gays, gypsies, the developmentally challenged, the jews and the list stretches far back into infamy.

We see it now with all the paranoia about someone who may appear to come from the middle east

If people don't like Furries, don't watch the video, don't go to their play places and complain. Live your life, let them live theirs. Find something important to complain about, like child poverty

As the saying goes "Do not interfere in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup." :)

I thought I'd jump in on this conversation, since it still seems to be going strong. A bit of background is necessary, I guess. I am not a furry, at least not in the conventional sense of what is being portrayed here. I've always been interested in roleplaying and, to a lesser extent at this point in life, costuming. Well into my mid-teens, I would dress up as a cowboy or a pirate or some such character for my own personal amusement. It was escapism, pure and simple.

When I was twelve or so, I got the idea that it would be cool to be a professional mascot. I was into all things baseball, and also thought it would be a wonderful job to be a play-by-play announcer. As a nonathletic person, I could be involved in a sport I loved (and still do) in a professional capacity. Ironically, I do work in radio, but in music rather than sports.

Later on, I got a job at a public library. It was pretty simple college student work: shelve books and clean up after the patrons leave. It was very tedious, and I soon became rather disenfranchised. But I was offered the ability to become the library's mascot. I jumped at the chance to live out the ambitions I had as a kid. And so, for several years, I would dress up as a dog and go to all sorts of public events for the library. I marched in parades, I visited schools, I even attending city council meetings dressed up in a dog costume. It was a lot of fun.

This is why I don't consider myself a furry: I was always financially compensated for what I did. If you took the money out of the equation, I still would have done it, but I would not have had the same motivation. And, at that point, I never really knew that such a subculture existed within fandom. Now that I do know, though, I doubt I'd be involved. I don't have time to hang out with other gamers that often as I'd like because my life's too busy.

I can relate to much of what the furries said. Putting a suit on like that can be an empowering experience. I had a different persona when I wore the suit, and I could get away with much more. Kids liked me, parents liked me, I got much more attention in that suit than any other time I go out in public. Most of that was positive, but some people reacted quite adversely. I suspect that people who don't like mascots and furries also have issues with clowns, and for many of the same reasons.

So I take furries at face value. They enjoy what they do. When not taken to extremes, it can be a positive hobby, just like tricking out a car or taking up a musical instrument. However, just like any other activity, one has to question whether or not an overriding behavior is a negative force in their life. I think the furries posting here would agree with me that balance is key.

Apologies for the long post.

Hey, that big squirrel looks VERY familiar!
http://www.starwars.com/community/fun/caption/2007/11/caption20071113.html

Furries, like a surprising number of other subcultures, are a spinoff of the science fiction fan community. I'll admit, I find them weird; but that's my problem, not theirs.

The anonymous commenter who said "Furries are nothing spiritual, it is no better than a foot fetish" doesn't know nearly enough about furries -- or about foot fetishists, for that matter.

It grieves me to see how many furry-affiliated readers (or readers who say they're part of furry fandom) are doing that tired old closeted-weirdo riff about how they're normal because they don't take all this stuff too seriously, and that it's the obsessive guys over there in the fursuits who are the real weirdos.

Malarkey. If you're into the fandom, you're there because you love it. It's a desperately sad thing to feel like you have to disparage something you care about. Besides, the world that prizes normality is never going to certify you as a fully qualified citizen.

I recommend reading Walt Willis and Bob Shaw's The Enchanted Duplicator, particularly chapters 10-11. The story's a bit out of date in some respects -- it was written back in the pre-internet days when fandom was held together by mimeographed fanzines -- but its basic insights still hold true.

I'm far from normal.

I'm a 21 year old straight male, 5' 9", 185 pounds of muscle (mostly) and live a very active life style. I enjoy musical production of the electronica flavor, and I DJ both online, and off. I smoke heavily (for good reasons, I assure you,) and drive a Kia Optima.

But I'm not normal...

I'm also enlisted in the US Army. I've gone to Iraq, served my time in hell, been in combat, and still have dreams about it. Sometimes, I still jump when car doors slam. Ask me about it, and I'll grin and tell you why I do it. Its so others dont have to.

And still I say unto thee, Nay, I am not normal.
I am not socially acceptable. I'm labeled as a freak, a basement dwelling animal humping, ugly, antisocial geek.

All because I'm a furry.

My argument is this: Why do fingers get pointed? What does anger manifest itself in? The answers are quite simple, really.

People fear what they dont understand, and they mask it with anger. Go ahead, be angry at me, and hate me for what I am. I'm not the one trolling around the internet, looking for someone to point and laugh at just because of differences. I'm not so insecure about myself that I need to mold my way of life around others so that I feel more accepted.

Ignorance is amazing, really it is. Collectively, humanity as a whole is extremely stupid and willfully blind. I'm not insulting anyones intelligence, and I mean no harm, but look at us. That said, theres small groups of people that just take the icing and the cake.

Sure, furries are WEIRD! Theres some out there that have quite frankly lost touch with reality, and thats sad. There are some that I wouldent like to talk to, let alone be around for more then 5 minutes.

Still, theres no reason to...prosecute them...us..., for lack of a better term.

You'd be surprised to find out how many furries there really are. Your boss with the picture of wild bears in his office? Could be a furry. Hell, your own mothers could all be furries and you'd never know unless you asked.

To sum up this whole long post: Those who need to turn unto others to better them selves and for laughter are those that are weakest, in heart mind and soul. Even better summary: All those pricks need to grow up :P