Talk:Judaism

Judaism on Education

Could we include the role of Jewish organizations in Judaism? Orthodox Union, Aish HaTorah, Chabad and Rohr JLI?

"Christianity and Nazism"

Can someone remove the agenda biased paragraph? i'm talking about this: "Christianity was originally...though a Christian belief in dual-covenant theology emerged as a phenomenon following Christian reflection on how their theology influenced the Nazi Holocaust.[135]" I'm not Christian myself and I can see the bias and hatred behind those lines. Not professional and should be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:A040:19B:31A9:FC4F:E94:F3C3:D534 (talk) 19:29, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

I see no bias or hatred in that section. Debresser (talk) 22:38, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

Jacobs as a source for an absurdity

any passing editor would catch as nonsense. See and comment here if you are not happy with the excision. Nishidani (talk) 15:53, 1 July 2020 (UTC)

Construal.

Within Judaism there are a variety of movements, most of which emerged from Rabbinic Judaism, which holds that God revealed his laws and commandments to Moses on Mount Sinai in the form of both the Written and Oral Torah. Historically, all or part of this assertion was challenged by various groups such as the Sadducees and Hellenistic Judaism during the Second Temple period;

• The Enc.Brit has two articles, one on (a) Judaism, the other on (b) Rabbinic Judaism. The former encompasses the latter, rabbinic Judaism being a subset of Judaism, for a simple reason: Judaism began several hundred years before rabbinic Judaism, which, yes, became overwhelmingly the dominant form of Judaism. Neither of those articles supports the incoherent synthesis we have here. So what we have is a numbskulled piece of WP:OR posing as reliably sources. I.e.

Rabbinic Judaism, the normative form of Judaism that developed after the fall of the Temple of Jerusalem (ad 70). Originating in the work of the Pharisaic rabbis, it was based on the legal and commentative literature in the Talmud, and it set up a mode of worship and a life discipline that were to be practiced by Jews worldwide down to modern times.

Even today the various Jewish groups—whether Orthodox, Conservative, or Reform—all claim direct spiritual descent from the Pharisees and the rabbinic sages. In fact, however, many developments have occurred within so-called normative or Rabbinic Judaism. In any event, the history of Judaism can be divided into the following major periods: biblical Judaism (c. 20th–4th century bce), Hellenistic Judaism (4th century bce–2nd century ce), Rabbinic Judaism (2nd–18th century ce), and modern Judaism (c. 1750 to the present).

Editors considering to revert, please note: there is no mention here of the Sadducees and Hellenistic Judaism in the Second Temple period challenging the Oral Torah of Rabbinic Judaism. Those two entries, if anything, support exactly my contention.

• The sentence we have, however, uses a definition of rabbinic Judaism to define Judaism, the subset defines the category of which it is part - which is logically inept and causes a chronological disturbance. Judaism however predates Rabbinic Judaism. Before Rabbinic Judaism, i.e. for several hundred years, members of Judaic communities did not necessarily subscribe to the later notion of the oral Torah.

• This confusion creates the problem in the second sentence. Having set out Rabbinic Judaism's two defining tenets (a)Written Torah and (b) Oral Torah, we are told that this assertion was challenged by the Sadducees and Hellenistic Judaism during the Second Temple period. The Second Temple period predates (see any authority) Rabbinical Judaism.

• You cannot write that these two groups challenged tenets of a movement that postdates by some centuries their own activities and existence.

• What the author(s) presumably wanted to say was: Of the several sects of Judaism in the Second Temple period, the Pharisees emerged after the destruction of the Temple, establishing two principles for Judaism, the two defining the emergent Rabbinic Judaism, that were to become normative for the following 2 millennia (and which the whilom Sadducees certainly opposed. They were literalists, and disliked leeway for glossing the Torah to create margins for inventive interpretation that in turn were invested with divine authority). If that wholly acceptable idea is what was meant, one should write it, and not the sentences we have, which are historically counterfactual.Nishidani (talk) 05:42, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

• That means that, before the establishment of Rabbinic Judaism the Sadducees and Hellenistic Jews opposed its central thesis. Nishidani (talk) 05:43, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

  Nishidani, as you know very well from the IP area, we go by RS. the EB is a RS. That is why I reverted you. Please try to be civil and don't bring your antagonistic behavior we know all too well from the IP conflict area into this area. Sir Joseph ^(talk) 01:15, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

That is not an answer. it is just a reaffirmation of your view I am given to antagonism which I now politely understand to be a synonym for 'interested in current and recent scholarship'.Nishidani (talk) 07:33, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

• Your interpretation of the supposedly problematic section of the article appears incorrect. I would suggest reading it again and trying to see where you’re going wrong. Île flottante (talk) 05:06, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

If neither of you have any knowledge of Judaism other than that garnered from the Encyclopedia Britannica and torah com, and have difficulties construing sentences, then obviously it is pointless expecting you to grasp anything here. Yawn. Nishidani (talk) 07:33, 6 July 2020 (UTC)