Hello again everybody!
Before we get started on today's post the current voting for Phione currently has votes for B tier in the lead!
So we'll tentatively put Phione into B tier and if anything changes I'll update on tomorrow's post!
Meanwhile the previous votes for Crawdaunt and Clodsire have officially ended so I've included the Weighted Average of those votes in the tier list below! :)
Reminder:
(Please note that this voting/tiering is centered around Classic as the current state of Endless requires specific strategies after a certain point.)
Current Tier List:
S tier:
Garganacl (4.37), Cloyster (4.01), Skeledirge (4.48), Gholdengo (4.49), Tinkaton (4.64), Latios/Mega (4.52)
A tier:
Gyarados/Mega (4.19), Venusaur/Mega/Dyna (3.80), Aegislash (4.06), Corviknight/Dyna (3.91), Excadrill (4.32), Gardevoir/Mega (3.99), Toxapex (3.50), Scizor/Mega (3.94), Gengar/Mega/Dyna (3.90), Delphox (3.62), Blastoise/Mega/Dyna (3.51), Blaziken/Mega (3.76), Swampert/Mega (3.76), Empoleon (3.57), Primarina (3.96), Quaquaval (3.77), Archaludon/Dynamax Duraludon (4.27), Azumarill (3.63), Volcarona (3.90), Ferrothorn (3.65), Raikou (3.58)
B tier:
Kanto-Persian/Dynamax Kanto-Meowth (3.25), Weavile (3.23), Starmie (2.92), Rhyperior (2.88), Quagsire (2.91), Mamoswine (3.25), Whimsicott (3.36), Aggron/Mega (3.48), Infernape (3.48), Alolan-Decidueye (2.89), Johto-Typhlosion (3.06), Torterra (3.03), Serperior (3.60), Unovan-Samurott (3.04), Chesnaught (2.74), Incineroar (3.49), Rillaboom/Dynamax (3.43), Inteleon/Dynamax (3.17), Hisuian-Typhlosion (3.15), Hisuian-Samurott (3.25), Flygon (3.31), Crawdaunt (3.38), Clodsire (3.10), Phione
C tier:
Linoone (2.97), Meganium (2.09), Emboar (2.39), Hisuian-Decidueye (2.65)
F tier:
Dustox (1.47)
Time for today's vote!
Today is our first official re-vote so today will look a little different than our normal votes. As you may have noticed in the tier list above, Gyarados and its Weighted Average have been crossed out, this is because today's vote's tier decision and Weighted Average will supercede the old vote but I still wanted everyone to be able to see where Gyarados was before. If you'd like to see the original vote here is the link to it:
A lot has changed in the 61 days since we voted on Gyarados. Both in the formatting of these posts and in-game for Gyarados itself. First off, since the time of that vote I've started to include in-depth analysis within the post itself in a mostly unbiased manner while also then including my personal opinion in the comments of the posts while discussing with other user's analysis. Back then I mostly just presented the data and then discussed in the comments, with minimal analysis within the post. Also I've included a lot more data from then to now based on requests from the community and updates to the game. This post can be used as well as an example of what exactly warrants a re-vote if you want to see a Pokemon re-voted on now or in the future as the game continues to evolve (Pokemon-pun intended).
For Gyarados itself in PokeRogue, it has had a massive rework since the time of the last vote, with some solid buffs and upon request with good reasoning and analysis given from a member of the community I've brought a re-vote back to the table for Gyarados. To save you some time and clicking back and forth I will include what Gyarados' kit was during the previous vote in the data below (with strikethroughs to make it easier to differentiate). Gyarados as a Pokemon is of course the same Pokemon its always been, it has good typing with a built-in immunity and only 2 weaknesses (although one is a 4x weakness) and 5 resistances. It has a low evolution level which makes up for the painful first 20 levels carrying Magikarp, and a low cost in this game of only 3 to start. It has a high base stat total with good Attack stat, solid bulk (especially on the Special side), and workable Speed. It also has 2 really good natural abilities to choose from in Intimidate or its Hidden Ability, Moxie. Its Mega Evolution improves all of its stats except for Speed and HP, and trades its Flying secondary typing for Dark, which gives it 3 more weaknesses at 5 (but no 4x weakness), 1 more resistance at 6 and trades the immunity to Ground for an immunity to Psychic. However, base form Gyarados' abilities are definitely better than its Mega Evolution which has Mold Breaker instead. Gyarados has a good level-up movepool with access to Dragon Dance as the most notable part, which it has a great stat spread to make use of, with already high Attack and enough Speed to out-speed most things at +1. It also has solid Water type physical STAB in Waterfall/Aqua Tail and coverage moves Crunch (which is also a STAB for the Mega Evolution) and Ice Fang. It even gets Whirlpool by level up if you want a passive damage option on it. The one thing its kit is notably missing is reliable recovery however. TM access gives it utility in Thunder Wave or other coverage options but nothing that's really make-or-break for it (Earthquake is really good for the Electric and Rock weaknesses to its base form however). All of this is of course the same as it was in the last vote because it's Gyarados' kit in mainline Pokemon games, but now we get to the differences. When we first voted on Gyarados its Passive Ability was Berserk for some reason (which wasn't even implemented at the time but even if it was is pretty useless for Gyarados as it much prefers to be a Physical attacker to Special especially if running Moxie). Now it has Multiscale which is an extremely good ability for an already pretty bulky Pokemon with Dragon Dance and a 4x weakness (just ask Dragonite about that), giving it an almost guaranteed chance to get set up. For Egg Moves the only one that stayed the same since then is Flip Turn which is a good option if you're using Intimidate on it to keep momentum and strong chip while switching. The other regular egg moves used to be Agility and Body Slam which Agility is really not preferred over Dragon Dance anyways in most scenarios and Body Slam is okay as a neutral coverage option which has a chance to Paralyze but Gyarados already learns it by TM (as well as Thunder Wave if you really want to Paralyze something). To replace those 2 it got Ice Spinner which is a huge upgrade over its natural Ice coverage in Ice Fang, and Power Trip which combines with Dragon Dance and Moxie extremely well (or if you have it Mega'd instead of Moxie for STAB boost). For Rare Egg Move it used to have Bounce which is nice to finally get some Flying type STAB but has not the best BP for a move with only 5 PP, a 5% chance to miss, allows the opponent a chance to switch into a resist and also is just slow to use consistently. Instead its Rare Egg Move is now Dragon Ascent which is extremely strong and still a Flying-type physical STAB attack for it and is even 100% accurate (although it does also only have 5 PP but with the Defense drops you don't really want to spam it too much unless you're already boosted enough to out-speed everything).
(Please note that Pokemon with Mega/Dynamax evolutions will be tiered as one Pokemon and not tiered separately for their Mega/Dynamax form. Different variants such as Alolan Persian vs. Kanto Persian will be tiered separately however.)
More Information About Voting/Tiering And Links To Past Votes:
What each tier generally means:
S tier:
Top tier, can make or break your entire run, essentially the cream of the crop.
A tier:
Very strong but not quite top tier, might be slightly outclassed or has a slight weakness holding it back.
B tier:
Solid choice that can make it to your endgame team, might be reliant on team composition to truly function well or might just be overall outclassed.
C tier:
Usually early-mid game 'Mons, ones you don't really want to take to end game if you can avoid it, usually pretty decently glaring weakness but something redeeming enough to keep from F tier.
F tier:
No reason to use in end game unless you're doing it for a meme/joke/completionist/Egg Voucher purposes.
Abstain/No Opinion:
This will be a voting option mostly for Pokemon people haven't unlocked/used to their full potential yet. Can also be used as a "See Results" button (remember Reddit won't let you change your vote however) if you don't want to skew the data but want to see the results of the vote.
Data with a strikethrough represents what Gyarados' kit was during the initial vote
(Data in parentheses is for Mega Gyarados)
Gyarados (Mega Gyarados)
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Type: Water/Flying (Water/Dark)
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Mega: Yes
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Dynamax: No
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Starter cost {Magikarp}: 3
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Possible Egg moves: Agility, Body Slam Bounce Flip Turn, Ice Spinner, Power Trip, Dragon Ascent
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Biomes: Lake, Sea
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Abilities: Intimidate (Mold Breaker)
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Hidden Ability: Moxie (Mold Breaker)
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Passive Ability: Berserk Multiscale - reduces the damage this Pokemon receives from attacks while at full HP by 50%
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Evolution: Magikarp evolves into Gyarados at level 20. Gyarados can Mega Evolve with Mega Bracelet and Gyaradosite.
Base stats:
Learnset by level up:
Splash, Flail, Tackle, Leer, Twister, Whirlpool, Ice Fang, Brine, Scary Face, Waterfall, Crunch, Rain Dance, Aqua Tail, Dragon Dance, Hydro Pump, Hurricane, Thrash, Hyper Beam
Learned upon evolution:
Bite
Notable TMs:
Protect, Chilling Water, Facade, Bulldoze, Dragon Tail, Avalanche, Sunny Day, Rain Dance, Hail, Sandstorm, Body Slam, Rest, Sleep Talk, Thunder Wave, Iron Head, Helping Hand, Earthquake, Stone Edge, Outrage, Power Whip, Scald, Muddy Water, Bounce, Toxic, Double Team, Swagger
Tomorrow's vote: Magnezone!
Pokemon on the radar for voting soon:
Lucario/Mega, Metagross/Mega, Armarouge, Ceruledge, Machamp/Dyna, Unfezant, Yanmega, Leavanny, Sinistcha, Wormadam-Trash, Gastrodon, Staraptor, Klefki, Kanto-Raichu, Gallade/Mega, Comfey, Araquanid, Crobat, Malamar, Walrein, Gliscor, Roserade, Vileplume, Minior, Hitmonchan, Bibarel, Chandelure, Alakazam/Mega, Flamigo, Barbaracle, Butterfree/Dyna, Beedrill/Mega, Mawile/Mega, Drednaw/Dyna, Annihilape, Cramorant, Aerodactyl/Mega, Glimmora, Tinkaton (re-vote), Scizor/Mega Scizor (re-vote), Heatran, Kartana, Mewtwo/MegaX/MegaY, Lunala, Solgaleo, Ogerpon, Tapu Koko, Dialga/Primal, Galarian-Zapdos, Regieleki, Regidrago, Zacian, Zamazenta, Rayquaza/Mega, Latias/Mega, Ho-Oh, Volcanion, Toxtricity/Dyna, Carbink, Porygon-Z, Cinccino, Snorlax/Dyna, Wishiwashi
(Other requests will be added to this list and this list is not necessarily in order)
Happy voting!
