I cannot stand the guy. Everything about him makes me hate him more. He’s insecure, jealous, misogynistic (in some scenes), and just an asshole. He keeps digging his grave the further I go into season 5…he’s just a walking red flag and Brianna deserves much more. Fuck I’d rather her be with the gay man who is in love with Jamie (I forget his name)

I just started reading Voyager. I've watched the show through twice and never really noticed these things, but in the books there are a few repeated elements that totally skeeve me out. I haven't been part of the conversation too long, so maybe these are common icks, but anyway, here are mine;

1. There are so many places in the first three books, at least, where paleness is praised, almost fetishized. DG writes at length about how pale and translucent female characters' skin is, you can see their veins - it seems to be a sign of purity, beauty, and innocence (thought it's applied a lot to Claire who certainly isn't innocent so idk, I'm not an English major). I can't remember any other skin tone (not that there are so many at this point in the books...) being described in such loving, artistic terms. (and I'm super pale white so it's not just that I am upset to not see my own traits praised). Ick.

2. There is a section in Voyager, maybe chapter 15 or 17, where Claire flies back to Boston, and she complains that the person sitting next to her had the *audacity* to be fat. I know Voyager was published in 1993, and the way we as a society talk about women's bodies has changed soooo much in the ensuing years, but still, it made me feel gross. And then it was quickly followed by a passage of Claire checking herself out in the mirror (ostensibly to compare her body to the last time Jaime saw her), and being so proud that there was no sagging, no dimpling of her butt, etc. - like wtf why can't she age like a normal human AND be okay with it? I understand feeling self conscious, but it would be a lot easier to feel connected to her, and love her character, if she wasn't so perfect. It's icky to me that her perfectness is so connected to her thinness and youth - seems like the only sign of aging anyone accepts is greying hair (the horror /s). Ick.

3. This is in a different category than my first two, but what is with all the drinking of breastmilk?? I saw a post a while ago questioning DG's apparent interest in breastmilk, and many people question the scene of Jenny riding a horse right after giving birth and the expression of milk in the woods, etc. - as a new mom who breastfed I actually love most of the descriptions of pregnancy, nursing, etc., and I love that she paints pregnancy as potentially sexy (although seems to be missing a whole swath of the very unsexy reality...), but why do so many men *drink* their partners' breastmilk?!?! A taste out of curiosity I totally get, but fully drinking?? WHY??? DG gets so much of motherhood right in Outlander (the day with the dinner party and the furnace busting and Claire freaking out omg perfect), and I'm not surprised because of course she is a mother, but the breastmilk obsession is an ick for me.

What are your ick tropes??? I want to know!

I AM ALREADY DONE WITH BOOK FOUR AND I AM SOOO HAPPY ABOUT IT I COULD CRY.

I give the book a 9/10

Why not a 10? Well... this was the first book that had me wanting to bang my head against the wall around 10 times.

The whole misunderstanding plot was SO ANNOYING. I liked some of the changes within, but even with those, somewhow this whole thing more became more frustrating.

Example:

Because Roger was going by Mackenzie and not Wakefield, Jamie had no way of knowing it was Roger that appeared in front of him looking for Bree. Jamie assumed this Mackenzie dude was his daughter's rapist. Bc it was hidden from him that it was actually Bonnet. He started to panic bc if the baby was his, the rapist would have all rights to claim Bree as his wife. So what does Roger do when Jamie gives him a chance to explain? (Which doesn't happen in the show) he says: "I came to claim my wife"

When I tell you guys I legit paused the book and facepalmed myself so hard I actually left a palm imprinted on my face, would you believe me?🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

And, I didn't think it was possible, but Roger kept saying the wrong thing, over and over. His encounter with Bree in the past was so aggressive, people around them wanted to interfere to defend Bree and no wonder Lizzie thought Roger was the bad man. The dude treated Brianna with so much hostility when he first found her, I couldn't believe it. From the outside, and at face value, it just looked bad.

I hated Roger in the show in season 4, and he grew on me later of course. But suddenly, reading the book, and revisiting this whole plot, made me hate him again lololol it gives me more perspective on why people always hate him so much at the beginning.

Another example of characters having a thing for saying the wrong thing in this book:

When Lord John and Bree are having their conversations, and LJ reveals the truth about his feelings for Jamie, Bree suddenly remembers that Jamie's only experience with a man was probably the worst thing that has ever happened to him, and she tries to bring up the question about BJR by mentioning Jamie's back scars. "Have you seen his back?" And Lord John says "you mean his scars? Yes, I made those."

NOOOOOOOO JOHN, NOOOOOO DON'T SAY THAT AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA (I facepalmed myself again) that was the absolute WORST possible way to reply to that question🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

Speaking of John, the dude is not the little meow meow the show portrays him to be. Nor is he the saint the fandom claims he is. I've seen people complain about Claire being hostile towards him, but in the book, John is EQUALLY hostile towards her. His feelings for Jamie are, in many occasions, in total display in front of her, he makes no effort to hide them. He has moments in which he is very disrespectful and says stuff Iike "don't worry I didn't come to seduce your husband" and in a particular moment in which we get his POV, he talks about how he has fantasized about plunging a knife on Claire's throat just bc he saw the way Jamie looks at her.

I still love John, but dang, I promise you all, Claire isn't the only one being irrational/hostile here.

I PROMISE YOU ALL I LOVED THE BOOK, haha. I just wanted to complain first lolol

Here are my faves:

1. Bree meeting her entire family in the past! Her aunt Jenny, her uncle Ian and all of her cousins!! It made me tear up!! It was such a beautiful moment!

2. Bree meeting Jamie. Waaaay better in the book. Their meeting felt absolutely magical.

3. Jamie and Claire were THERE for the birth of Jemmy! YES. YES. YES.

4. The Mohawk weren't as aggressive in the book. They welcomed Jamie, Claire and Ian at the beginning and their exchange wasn't as hostile.

5. Ian showed interest in the Indians from the beginning. He became friends with many of them, making his decision to stay with the Mohawk not only about Roger, but also about him.

6. Loved all the letter exchanges between Jenny, Ian and Jamie. Ian asking Jamie for young Ian to stay with him bc if he were to come back, his only purpose would be to join the soldiers? Beautiful.

7. And of course! JAMIE AND CLAIRE. AND THEIR UNMATCHED chemistry ❤️❤️❤️ their sexy moment on top of the rock/in the river. Them undressing in the forest, literally having the most magical forest sex ever LOL worthy of a fairytale 😍

Anyway let me know what you all think of my post! Haha share your thoughts with me! :)

I met my husband because I was at the store buying snacks for my faithful Outlander watch. It was season 1 and I remember I said something about needing my snacks for Outlander that night and he replied that he too was getting snacks for Outlander, and he offered to take me out for dinner the next day so we could chat about the new series.

Now we use so much phrasing for the show I'm sure we sound absolutely crazy to people who can hear our conversations.

He calls me mo chridhe.

We both use the term honeypot now.

My husband called our daughter leannan from the day she was born.

We have a giant braided gardenia named Sassenach.

We use dinna fash when one of us is upset over a slight inconvenience.

All of this thanks to Season One!

He is so sweet and kind and honorable and wants to be loved! I just want to hug him while he cries over his unrequited love for you-know-who 😭 . It made me so sad to see his teary eyes in Jamaica. But on a lighter note, I was cracking up at the scene: “Do you have a warrant?” “No” “Do you have an affidavit?” “No”. I don’t know why I found that scene so hilarious but I did. It was a nice moment of comic relief. (I am only up to season 3 and haven’t reached LJG in the main books yet but I hear he has a bigger role in the future and I am excited for it Also does anyone recommend reading Scottish prisoner even if I don’t read all the other John Grey books first?)

Hey friends!

Anyone have any status updates on book 10? i’ve seen her say its the final book, but then when reading bees it really didn’t feel like it should be the end…? then i read back a tweet a while ago her saying she might split the plot of book 10 between two novels etc.

Have there been any happenings on the status that i missed out on? is the next book for real the end of outlander? Do we have a name or a relase date? what do u guys think and feel about that.

Cheers x

Is Jenny riding a horse two days after giving birth. I can't believe DG had had three children and still wrote that scene.

Historically, he would have had an Italian accent since he was born and raised in Rome. It would have been cool if the actor spoke in an Italian accent instead of an English one. A tour guide in Scotland told me the Outlander series is quite historically accurate (besides the time travel part...), but he told me Prince Charles should have had an Italian accent. I do, however, think the actor visually was a good casting for the Bonnie Prince.

Basically, I’ve been dealing pretty well with a lot of Claire and Jamie’s drama up until this season. I know they were apart for too long but I can’t view this relationship as anything else but utterly toxic for Claire. The scene where they’re arguing after Claire finds out Jamie kept his marriage a secret from her out of cowardice was okay to me, he felt a very hard pain with her absence. But when she confronts him about it, not only he spouts like a child claiming she left her, tells her she could kill her then proceeds to nearly assault her (I was in shock during that scene) it felt out of place even considering his change. Plus, it feels like it’s always been Claire who needs to put aside her anger and discomfort for Jamie’s sake. It basically almost always starts with her opening up, they fight, and then Claire is the one who needs to comfort him. Then he’s being a complete manchild about Fergus and Marsali (granted I haven’t watched long enough to figure out why). I KNOW he’s supposed to be a flawed character and bla bla bla but it’s been hard to swallow him as a proper companion for Claire this season. I just wanna know if he’s going to get any better this season, I’m hopeful since there are so many to go.

Ok so, I’m trying to remember details from some of the novellas and main books but need some help. I know there’s the one story where the comte gets some woman pregnant, right? What year would that have been and how old would that child be in the course of the main books? Trying to figure out if that child could be anyone that we’ve met, thanks!

I am watching outlander for the first time. I love the story overall. But the amount of violence is frustrating.

When something traumatic happens, I want to feel for the characters. But it is just so overdone. It almost seems like they wanted to keep it interesting and the only way they know how to do that is by making a character endure something terrible. Even when it doesn’t make sense. And that is annoying when it distracts from an otherwise great story.

I feel like they do Jamie’s character a disservice with all that they put him through. After a certain point, I lost any real feelings about Jamie because watching him get abused (in every way, shape, and form) and then keep on keeping on every episode feels two dimensional.

The sexual assaults are so overdone. Every character has been at this point. And the characters are almost always fine after a day or so and it’s back to normal (unless they can tie their processing into another plot line.)

These people need to invest in locks because as soon as they have a moment of peace, that’s when you know random characters we have never met are going to be introduced by barging in and being monsters.

I understand “life was more brutal back then.” I don’t doubt that. But to me it feels unrealistic which strips the emotion from it.

Has your scene been included in the show? I personally would have loved to have seen the slippery rock played out - waterweed, anyone? And I absolutely cannot wait to see 7B and if that garden shed appears, phheewww 😮‍💨😮‍💨

I was introduced to Outlander by my girlfriend, who has only ever watched the show. She's watched all of the show that has released. After I read each book we watch the corresponding season. So after I finished Fiery Cross, we watched season five. Lo and behold, I saw some major spoilers, because I had not read ABOSAA yet.

I've just finished ABOSSA, so my question is, am I good to watch season 6, or will I encounter more spoilers in season 6? Do I go ahead and read EITB just to be safe? And are the rest of the books just as good as ABOSSA because golly, that was amazing.

I feel very sorry for Malva and wish that they discovered the truth and Allen was the one to meet his doom before he was able to kill her. I feel like she would have been awesome to keep around with helping Claire on her voyage back to Scotland since Marsali has been gone with Fergus

Rewatching season 6 and it’s genuinely making me laugh how dreadful they were at hiding Cait’s belly. There are so many instances where it’s just right there in full view 😂

Am I the only one who’s so annoyed by some of the things that Claire does? Like picking up the baby’s coffin to carry it during that funeral.. come on now, you HAD to know that everyone was gonna freak tf out over that lol.

And her using the ether.. & not talking to Jamie about the way she’s struggling with the trauma from that whole incident. I’m just feeling like I wanna scream at the TV & wondering if there’s anyone else who feels the same way lol 😅

EDIT: I post my opinions because I really enjoy getting feedback from you all. It helps me examine why I think and feel the way I do about things.

Most of the time when I feel so strongly about something, I realize that it’s probably not rational for me to feel that way, but I don’t quite know why I do. That’s why it’s so enjoyable to have these discussions with people who are as equally as invested in the series as I am.

I never mean anything I say in a negative way & I appreciate you guys & your input. 🩷

How do I cover part of my post/comments so I can discuss spoilers?

It would seem to me that a story about Jemmy and Mandy in the future would be a wonderful addition to the outlander world.

In the later books, when the MacKenzies come back, do they ever find out that Jamie dreamt of them? Like when he saw Jem try to phone granda?

I’m in Bees currently, and a stray dog just showed up with Jamie talking vaguely about burying her master. I’m super confused because I’m not sure if this was something that was previously mentioned, but I don’t want to google it in case it’s a new mystery. Am I supposed to know who the dog’s master is before this point?

I have literally watched the entire series at least 6 times and I’m JUST noticing that the place where Jamie goes to meet the Sons of Liberty guy has Stephen Bonnet’s bollocks in a jar. That is freaking hilarious lol. For those who have read the books, do they provide any more insight on that or is it mentioned? I was cracking up when I saw that part just now 😅😂