How to avoid a car crash interview
Woolworths CEO Brad Banducci now has plenty of time to reflect on Monday night’s car crash interview. Here’s what other leaders can learn.
It is slightly terrifying to think that Brad Banducci’s eight-year career as CEO of Woolworths could come to an abrupt end, after just one bad moment.
Woolworths chairman Scott Perkins insists the timing of Banducci’s exit was “completely unaffected” by the ABC interview, but it certainly looked that way to the public.
And while we all have moments of stress and regret in life, as a leader you hope they do not happen during a major interview on national television like Four Corners.
Either way, it is something we have seen time and time again, most recently with the departure of Optus CEO Kelly Bayer Rosmarin, after the telco’s network meltdown and a string of defensive media interviews and her Senate grilling.
“I don’t think it’s a problem with the communications. It’s a problem that customers wanted a different message,” she said in one interview. “We’re very, very sorry that it happened. But I don’t think it’s something unusual in the grand scheme of things when you’re operating a critical infrastructure.”
There have been any number of chief executives being grilled in recent months from former PwC boss Luke Sayers to Qantas CEO Vanessa Hudson to the big bank bosses, stretching back to the Hayne royal commission, which saw the exit of National Australia Bank chairman Ken Henry – who had refused to have any coaching ahead of his appearance.
Optus chief Kelly Bayer Rosmarin being grilled in the Senate. Alex Ellinghausen
“I can’t tell you how many times I’ve relived that appearance – I understand the criticism. I did not perform well. I really should have performed quite differently. I should have been much more open,” Henry later said.
The 59-year-old Banducci – who admits “I haven’t managed to dodge every bullet” – now has plenty of time to reflect on whether he could have handled things better during Monday night’s car crash interview.
It followed his recent admission that he “misread the political environment” by cancelling Australia Day merchandise and the spectre of six concurrent inquiries into price gouging by the supermarkets.
So what went wrong in the interview? And what can other leaders learn?
‘When will they learn?’
Leadership and communication coach Michael Kelly asks “when will these CEOs learn that they need to work on the way they deliver, as much as what they are saying?”
“Anything could happen and you need to be brutal in your preparation,” he says.
“One of the key messages I share, when working with leaders in how to listen and speak under pressure, is that ‘he or she who loses their cool, loses’. Losing his cool in his ABC interview is a telling example of what not to do, when under pressure.”
The problems can be grouped into three areas, says executive coach, body language and vocal expert Louise Mahler.
1. Approach
“Yes, the journalist may take a confrontational approach, but blow me over if that is a surprise to anyone. In response, to take a combative and bristling approach is akin to diving into a cauldron of burning gases and hoping to come out alive,” she says.
“Watch Hillary Clinton laugh in crisis. Watch Richard Branson swagger and joke. Even, dare I say it, watch Daniel Andrews enjoy his own sarcasm. There needs to be a lightness of approach, a sense of humour, a feeling of ‘perhaps you need me to help you understand’.”
2. Framework
There are also “arrangements” for every single communication, Mahler says.
“Straight out confrontational answers, using demeaning phrases like ‘as I told you already’ or misdirecting to irrelevance such as ‘he is retired’ [to undermine the comment of an expert] is in poor taste.
Dr Louise Mahler: “Watch Hillary Clinton laugh in crisis. Watch Richard Branson swagger and joke.” Peter Braig
But as Kelly agrees, the bigger issue for Banducci was in storming out of the interview and then coming back – and how that looked – rather than the point about Rod Sims having retired. You are a public figure and cannot try for a “do over”, Kelly says.
3. Delivery
The key to communication is delivery, delivery and delivery, Mahler agrees.
“Storming out of an interview when you don’t get what you want is childish and then creeping back in is plain ugly. Even the way Mr Banducci stood up, throwing his body forward, was an aggressive move, unbecoming for any CEO.”
“Sitting at an angle with a tightly sealed mouth and glaring eyes, is a recipe for disaster and barking responses will bring on a fight. It is quite simply poor choice, totally ineffective and might I say, old-fashioned.”
Mahler’s practical tips for success are:
- Use simple guides to decide on an approach and adopt techniques such as mantras to guide the mental state.
- Have a framework for questions, for emotional responses and for providing feedback and for offering perspectives, instead of answering shotgun off the top of your head.
- Know your body is under stress and make conscious responses physically and vocally as opposed to stress-inspired reactions.
“It’s not rocket science, but we have ignored these skills for so long, we are behind the eight-ball, and maybe we are going to have to start from the beginning,” Mahler says.
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