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Novavax is outNorth America (self.PrepperIntel)

submitted by OnTheEdgeOfFreedom

For people who still don't trust the mRNA vaccines, there's an updated vaccine for Covid based on older technology, available in the US. (Edit: edited because the post implied this was a new vaccine - but it's just a new formulation of the vaccine, not quite the same thing.)

https://yourlocalepidemiologist.substack.com/p/novavax-is-here

When I say "available" I'm talking loosely. Availability may be scarce for a time. The link has details on finding it.

Yes, it's been fully tested, the same as any US-released vaccine. It's also believed to have fewer side effects, and it doesn't seem any less effective than mRNA vaccines, so if you didn't like the day-after effect of previous Covid vaccines, this might be the one for you. (I'm sticking with mRNA for now as it's never been a problem for me.)

I'm sure there will still be people who refuse to countenance any vaccine that hasn't been in wide use in ten years or whatever. If that's you, great, no real need to comment, we get it. Folk who start screaming about "it hasn't been tested enough!" and "it doesn't have 3 years of field use!" or "you'll grow moth wings in 2 years!" will assumed to be anti-vaccine trolls and that will be the last comment I see from you.

​

Addendum: Oh, look, I irritated some trolls. Again. Oh dear me.

I block people after skimming their comment history, when it becomes obvious to me that either they're simply trolls, or literally unwilling to provide cites and references when they make outrageous claims. I block because it saves me time; I don't want to run into the same trolls over and over and anyway, I'm not here to debate. On the topic of epidemiology, I lay out what I know from my training, I provide cites and references, and I move on. People who want to argue but don't provide cites? Of course that's a non-starter. Half the point of my posts is to refine my block list; if you aren't going to bother to learn the basics about something as important as vaccination and are fool enough to prove it publicly, I'm certainly not going to bother with your other prepping "info."

You want to engage with me, bring your peer reviewed studies or at least articles from established, mainstream epidemiologists. You have no interest in anything mainstream? Fine, I'm not interested in hearing your regurgitated opinions from Robert Kennedy Jr, Ron Johnson or your aunt sally's hairdresser.

If you have a problem with that, I'd say it's quite a problem you have there. And if you run to the defense of another obvious troll, I simply assume you're in the next cubical over, somewhere in Russia, and you're gone too.

Ever try arguing with a gas station owner about climate change? Arguing with an anti-vaccine troll is no different; they're either paid to troll outright (*waves to our Russian friends*) or have financial reasons to downplay masks, vaccinations, Covid itself, et al.. No one sensible bothers with them.

But by way of fair reply, to the people complaining that novavax can't possibly have been tested if it was formulated against a recent strain: bring it up with the FDA, who reviewed the data and issued the authorization under an EUA, as described in my cite, above. People who don't think that's good enough presumably don't get flu vaccines either, since they're also updated yearly and go through a similar process. If you are anti-vaccine enough to avoid flu vaccines because they reformulate the payload, you're too anti-vaccine for me to waste time on. I'm not talking to you. I'm talking to people who are prepping against diseases.

Covid vaccines have been out for a few years now. We know the side effects of the mRNA vaccines, as well we should, after 3 years and 10 billion doses administered worldwide. Likewise, vaccines in the class of novavax are using even older technologies which are well understood and well tested, and people trying to convince you that swapping a payload protein for a related one is grounds for fear and loathing, do not have the data on their side or your best interest at heart. It's past time for even paid trolls to realize that the game is over.

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[–]LadyDenofMeade 57 points58 points  (2 children)

Novavax isn't new. We were giving it last year. We had people driving 3 states over because they wanted it.

[–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Yup, I fixed the post to make that clear, thanks.

[–]LadyDenofMeade 11 points12 points  (0 children)

You're all good! I think my comment came out with more snark than intended.

3 years of these vaccines and the public in public health, I am so beyond done with everything covid vaccine related 🙃

[–]kingofthesofas 28 points29 points  (2 children)

My wife and I were part of the Stage III clinical trials for Novavax and the Novavax booster. Generally much lower symptoms compared to mRNA vaccines in our experience.

[–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Thank you! The folk who do the trials are the best of the best, and while phase 3 is very low risk - they're testing for efficacy at that point - it's still something to roll up a sleeve before a few million people have paved the way for you. Hats off.

[–]kingofthesofas 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Thanks! I felt like it was doing our little part to fix the pandemic even though it was small it was at least something.

[–]jujumber 61 points62 points  (14 children)

Thanks. Moderna vaccines knocked me on my ass. Felt like I was hit by a truck.

[–]Thoraxe474 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Moderna makes me unbelievably sick for 4 to 5 days each shot. Hoping novavax goes better... If I can find it...

[–]hh3k0 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Moderna vaccines knocked me on my ass. Felt like I was hit by a truck.

I had 2x Biontech and 2x Moderna so far. First shot was fine, all the others hit me like a truck, too. They had me lying in bed for ~12 hours, breaking into such violent shivers that I could not sleep at all. It wasn't a great experience but it could've been worse -- and I haven't caught SARS-CoV-2 so far (or have been asymptomatic). So it was worth it, imo. I'll try the updated Novavax this time, though. Perhaps that one will feel a little more agreeable.

[–]thisbliss4 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Unless you are at high risk for complications from Covid, the 36 sleepless hours that you spent shivering strikes me as a high price to pay for immunity.

Then again, easy for me to say, because I opted to be in the de facto control group: no vaccine side effects and no Covid (yet).

[–]hh3k0 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Unless you are at high risk for complications from Covid […]

There are several factors at play for me. First and foremost, I am a knowledge worker – there are relatively common Covid-19 sequelae (such as brain fog) that would be a catastrophe for me. Decades ago I developed post-viral syndrome after a viral infection and it impairs me to this day, although not as badly as it once has. And lastly, there are a lot of children in my extended family… which means I basically catch every 2nd or 3rd bug they come home with and I consequently deemed the prospect of avoiding SARS-CoV-2 altogether plain unrealistic.

Then again, easy for me to say, because I opted to be in the de facto control group

Why not Novovax, though? That's a run-of-the-mill vaccine and not an mRNA one.

[–]DudeLoveBaby 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't know, 36 hours of shivering and no sleep sounds a lot better than the week that fell off of my calendar while I was laid up with Corona.

[–]Natedawg316 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why do you want to kill everyone's grandma? Didn't you hear it is a pandemic of the unvaxed?

[–]smokejaguar 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Same. First shot went just fine, but about 12 hours after receiving my second dose, I awoke from sleep with my heart racing and was completely soaked in sweat. It was a solid week before I could climb a flight of stairs without getting winded.

That said, dose 3 has no such impact.

[–]Millennial_on_laptop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think by dose 3 or 4 you've built up some antibodies and are almost "immune" to the vaccine.
You can build up a defense against "fake/simulated COVID" the same way you can for the real thing.

[–]The_Wicked_Wombat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That doesn't feel like it should happen with any vaccine

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Such a varied experience. My first one I felt fatigued from my immune system reacting/creating antibodies, but it wasn't awful. Some soreness. Felt a little tingly after injection but that went away. Nothing unique, I get the same from a flu vaccine. I went home early one day, and that was it. Second shot, no symptoms, no tingling, no fatigue. Third booster, nothing. Fourth updated booster, nothing.

[–]Natedawg316 2 points3 points  (2 children)

5th? Or do you not want to be fully vaccinated?

[–]Millennial_on_laptop 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Depends where you live, the updated booster is only available to people under 60 in Canada at the end of October so that's when I'll be going for the 5th.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'll be getting a fifth, soon, ish. I hope. When there's actually a vaccine available anywhere, period. Not sure what I'll get, whether it is moderna or novavax, may just be based on availability.

[–]KegelsForYourHealth 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Lot of fanfic in this thread.

[–]KarmaPharmacy 97 points98 points  (70 children)

I got kicked out of banned from r/coronavirus for stating my personal experience with the Pfizer Vaccine. For a simple comment nested in comments.

I was 100% pro vax and was so excited to get my first two.

I got my period for a year straight starting a few days after the second dose, I often lost a liter of blood per day. I had enormous blood clots. Some the size of 40 ml of blood.

I went to several pro vaccine doctors. After running a ton of tests, my obgyn and pcp told me never to get the covid vaccine again.

Just wanted to let you know that the censorship on Reddit regarding the vaccine is real and disturbing, at best.

[–]Marie4558 15 points16 points  (0 children)

My immune system also did not respond well. I didn't have a period for 6 months after my second dose only to have the heaviest period of my life, drenching pads, then nothing for 4 months, it did "normalize" after. After the third I developed hypothyroidism (literally tested months before and had normal numbers). And the fourth and last one I'll ever take, I developed Dermatographia, and mild/severe itching, I literally get welts itching my skin now :( and there is no fix for it.

[–]Jodette345 4 points5 points  (2 children)

TLDR: I believe the vaxxes weakened my immune system.

I was completely pro-vax too. Both Moderna vax and two Moderna boosters. A month after 2nd booster I landed in hospital for 7 days with pneumonia and kidney infection (never have I had anything like that). I never tested positive for covid, however, docs told me it was most likely covid but the viral load wasn't high enough to get a positive result. I was tested for covid antibodies and the results were high. Pcp says I was most likely infected with covid.

A month after being released from hospital I got shingles, developed severe hyperkeratotic hand eczema that requires me to wear cotton gloves at night after applying the Rx ointment; started with GERD/gastroparesis requiring Rx medication; recurrent UTIs/interstitial cystitis; post exertional fatigue; sleep disturbances/insomnia. Never have I had anything remotely like this in my entire life, and I've worked in healthcare/mortuary business my entire adult life and have been exposed to TB, hepatitis, meningitis, flu, RSV, blood, urine, vomit and feces...you name it, and never got sick.

I'm not discouraging anyone from getting the latest vax. I am saying that for some people, the vaxxes assaulted our immune systems. Both my pcp and urologist have advised me against getting any type of vaccines for at least a year.

At the height of covid before any vax was available and the media was reporting death after death, I was masking (still do), washing my hands/gloving, social distancing, being diligent about sanitizing surfaces (still am) and never got sick. Yet a month after second booster I land on my ass in the hospital and a year later am still dealing with post infection sequelae, call it long covid, vaccine injury...whatever you want. All I know is, this all started after the second booster.

Like I said, I'm not antivaxx, I even stayed current with my tetanus boosters over the years. However, for some of us, I firmly believe the covid vaxxes/boosters affected our immune system not in a good way.

[–]KarmaPharmacy 2 points3 points  (1 child)

My neighbor’s son died just a couple of days after his second shot. He never had heart problems before, but he keeled over in his gamer chair while his wife read the kids to sleep.

He was mid thirties

[–]Jodette345 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My 56 yo nephew, works out, protein eating, strong af man got a dvt in his leg 3 weeks after booster. His sister, my 52 yo niece, developed Takotsubo Cardiomyopathy, aka broken heart syndrome, days after second booster and was in hospital for a week. Neither of them had any past medical history of cardiac or clotting issues.

Some people suffer no ill effects, some people suffer multiple effects that adversely affect their quality of life.

[–]MongoMongo77 32 points33 points  (7 children)

You lost almost 20% of your blood in a single day? How long were you hospitalized for?

[–]KarmaPharmacy 3 points4 points  (6 children)

I don’t even remember. That whole year felt like a fever dream, at best. I couldn’t move, I couldn’t think.

[–]MongoMongo77 -1 points0 points  (5 children)

I get you were weak, but didn't you get some kind of paperwork from the hospital that says how long you were there? I mean how did someone loosing a liter of blood a day and surviving not make the news?

[–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Yeah. This would have been the equivalent of page one in some major med journals. And I poke around in a handful of those and never heard anything like this. There have been cases of myocarditis, generally very treatable and resolving in a few days. There's the usual handful of allergic reactions. Massive bleed-out for a year? There is something very wrong with KarmaPharmacy's story.

Some of you will have heard of Tiffany Dover. She fainted on live TV right after getting vaccinated. That's all that happened - she got up afterwards, but just from having fainted she became national news and the focus of conspiracy theories demanding she'd actually died and it was covered up. (In fact, she has always been prone to fainting fits.)

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/misinformation/tiffany-dover-conspiracy-theorists-silence-rcna69401

A story like Karma's would have been everywhere if it had been tied to the vaccine.

[–]KarmaPharmacy 7 points8 points  (3 children)

I didn’t tell anyone. My local hospital is pro vax and saying anything against the vaccines would likely have resulted in both doctors getting fired. Believe it or not, this is not the kind of shit I want to be known for. I felt disgusting. I was embarrassed. I had absolutely no energy to even put up a fight.

And look at how much bullshit and speculation I’m receiving just from you two.

“Oh it’d be on national news” fuck no it would not be. That requires patient consent and for the media not to be owned by shareholders/a board or directors.

I’m not alone. There isn’t “something seriously wrong with my story.”

It’s that people like you will side with your instincts rather than my earnestness and the expertise or two extremely well educated doctors. It’s also statistically probable that you have some bias, seeing as that I’m a woman.

But thank you SO MUCH for your concern and well wishes!

[–]peppabuddha 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Are you doing better now??? That is so scary :(.

[–]KarmaPharmacy 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Right around the one year mark it stopped completely. I was so nervous that it would come back. But it hasn’t! I was exhausted for months after, but took a lot of supplements to try to come back from anemia. I’m doing much better now! My periods are so light, it is amazing.

Thank you for asking 🤍

[–]MongoMongo77 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm not siding with anyone. I'm honestly curious how someone can lose 20% of their total blood day after day and survive. That's absolutely astounding. I think it's only normal to be curious about something like that happening.

[–]NewsteadMtnMama 25 points26 points  (2 children)

A liter of blood a day? There are only 5 liters in the entire body - how were you not hospitalized for transfusions?

[–]KarmaPharmacy 14 points15 points  (0 children)

I was

[–]Crimsuhn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s simple, they’re lying

[–]ThisIsAbuse 16 points17 points  (6 children)

I am pro antibiotics and have had many types. However two years ago I got a special antibiotic used for a UTI and got severally ill - hives from head to two, high fever, vomiting, shaking so bad for days. My doctor could not believe it at first as all his patients take it fine. I have it now banned on all my medical records.

[–]Grimaceisbaby 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Was it a fluroquine? Have you ever looked into EDS?

[–]KarmaPharmacy 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Which anti biotic?

[–]bristlybits 9 points10 points  (1 child)

that sounds like a penicillin allergy, my cousin has it.

[–]WrenchesRUs 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Penicillin allergies suck ass. I've been allergic to it my whole life, as was my mom, and her mom. My son has it too , as far as we know. Have only tried it once. Theres actually a pretty high number of people I know who are allergic to it unfortnately

[–]Sunsetseeker007 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I had the same thing happened to me after antibiotic that I have taken before fine!!

[–]Grimaceisbaby 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I mentioned novavax should be an available option as someone who’s had a very bad experience to two moderna vaccines and got banned from a local sub. It’s really scary how competition has become so political. Until covid disappears, why wouldn’t we welcome more tools? There’s been bot involvement for sure. I hope it’s not pharmaceutical companies but it’s not looking great.

[–]PinataofPathology 29 points30 points  (15 children)

I literally had spine surgery triggered by the vaccines. The inflammation that COVID and COVID vaccines cause are accelerating various tumors in my body. It has royally sucked.

[–]KarmaPharmacy 14 points15 points  (0 children)

I am so sorry. I deal with inflammation in my spine and it’s atrocious, I know. I wouldn’t wish it on anyone

[–]t0astter 21 points22 points  (10 children)

I had tendonitis in damn near every part of my body that's just now starting to disappear. Along with heart palpitations and some lipomas I never had. My dad developed afib.

[–]SurvivalFloating2 18 points19 points  (4 children)

My joint issues got much worse after my third Moderna shot. I did have heart palpitations too (mycarditis?), but they resolved after a couple of months. The joint stuff never got better, though.

[–]WrenchesRUs 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Hmmm, I wonder if that's common? I feel like I have the same issues? I was fine before all the covid stuff, after being vaxxed I kind of felt this might have been the case. I'm 31 now and my knees, hips, and my back are all so damn messed up theres days I'm almost cripple and almost need help out of bed. I'm not overweight, in fact I'm in the best shape physically I've ever been so I dont understand it. I walk a minimum of 2km a day just getting my oldest to school

[–]SurvivalFloating2 2 points3 points  (2 children)

This is disturbing, and I wouldn't say it's common but not rare either. I wish we would get more studies about this or better, more funding for research into a pan corona vaccine that would avoid the current mechanism of action entirely.

I'm trying to find the Novavax vaccine in hopes of fewer side effects, as I still need to be vaccinated. But there isn't a location yet within 100 miles of me. I'm hoping that will change as more purchases go through this week.

[–]peppabuddha 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Check your local Costco...even non-members can get the Novavax there I hear.

[–]SurvivalFloating2 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you! I always forget about Costco.

I believe anything that is federally regulated (pharmaceuticals, eyeglasses, and gasoline) can be purchased by non-members at Costco. I'm going to give it a week to allow for the vaccine to get distributed and then see what I can find.

[–]Seat-Life 14 points15 points  (4 children)

Youre not alone. I got it bad and ended up tearing tendons in both arms at work. Never had any problems until after my second moderna shot.

[–]t0astter 12 points13 points  (3 children)

Jesus, really?? It's so weird. I literally never had issues like this in my life - I had been powerlifting for a number of years so my tendons are quite strong, but after the vaccines even the littlest shit seemed to be capable of giving me crazy burning tendonitis pain. Still dealing with Achilles tendonitis in both legs over 2.5 years later.

[–]Seat-Life 12 points13 points  (2 children)

Yes, no joke. Both extensor tendons were ripped. One over 50%.

I lift too or rather, did. Thats what freaked me out first. My 20lb free weights were suddenly kicking my ass. I was having carpal tunnel flares in both hands. All kinds of stuff. Brain fog, anger issues. It didnt make sense.

Went from working 10 hours days so my arm is SORE if I used it for more than a minute.

[–]t0astter 13 points14 points  (1 child)

You had carpal tunnel flares too?! Same here and mine got so bad I was debating on quitting my job (programmer) as it was too painful to work most days.

Only thing that seems to be helping me is a LOT of vitamin C, curcumin 2-3x/day, and time. Lots of anti-inflammatory action with those two.

Are your tendons healing at least? I'm having a hell of a time with these Achilles.

[–]Seat-Life 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I had to get carpal tunnel release surgery in both hands. It's been fine since then. It was flaring at like 3am every day and it would wake me up from a dead sleep in 10/10 pain.

Tendons seem better, but not like they were. I have to really take it easy. I figured maybe mid 40s id feel like this, but not at 35.

[–]WrenchesRUs 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Wow really? That's...alarming at best. Any idea how common of an issue that is....?

[–]PinataofPathology 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's hard to say because discussion was heavily and actively censored early on because they wanted everyone to get vaccinated without questioning it and I'm very provax. I love every vaccine I've ever had until covid. I rely on vaccines to keep me out of the hospital because I have some pretty serious respiratory issues so I'm not antiv. I'm going to sound a little bit antiv because I've had bad experiences with the covid vaccines but I am not anti-vax. I want a better vaccine. I want a more effective vaccine. I want a vaccine that does not have these side effects and I did report everything to the CDC and they followed me for about a year.

Note it's not that covid caused the actual problem. It's just that it inflamed things and took them to a tipping point where I had to have surgeries and where tumors were suddenly starting to grow.

With the first round of vaccines there was a Facebook group that was fairly serious about trying to document and track these side effects and it was shut down.You couldn't even talk about it here on Reddit so there was very active censorship and now the fringe alternative health people have gotten a hold of everything and have made it weird. So we're still not having a great conversation, but at least I can share my experience and not get deleted censored downvoted so that is progress, but we need to have a science-based conversation and instead we're now having a lot of alt right alt medicine.

[–]Crimsuhn -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Post your redacted records proving this, otherwise you’re just an antivax Larper

[–]nakedrickjames 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Really not a fan of the mod team there. I had a post removed (automoderated) when I linked to a preprint on BioRxiv. When I pointed out that there's nothing listed in the sub rules / faq about preprints, and how it would probably be helpful to note that somewhere, I got banned for a few days.

[–]SurvivalFloating2 9 points10 points  (6 children)

I was banned for the same thing (mentioning others had menstrual problems plus my own worsening arthritis symptoms)...IN SPITE OF saying outright I was as vaccinated as I could be at the time, planned to get vaccinated again, and actually sold vaccines in the past for a big pharma company.

My conclusion is experiences like ours, coupled with that sub's continued "you go mask, but we can't expect others to, including doctors, so stop advocating for masks" show the real agenda behind the forum.

[–]KarmaPharmacy 4 points5 points  (3 children)

I’m so sorry. We deserve a platform that allows us to articulate our issues and experiences.

Reddit didn’t used to be censored…. at all. There were horrific child porn subs (thankfully I never came across those), a lot of hate against any race that wasn’t white and any gender that wasn’t cis male. If Reddit could allow that to happen, why can’t we discuss negative effects of a vaccine? It’s science...

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–]SurvivalFloating2 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    That sub is clearly astroturfed by CDC, FDA, and other government drones -- the same people telling everyone to wash their hands for an airborne disease and dragging their feet on releasing vaccines (which need to be administered at least twice a year in order to really be effective). All in service to capitalism and probably some dark money outside the US that would like to see the country collapse. When a pandemic is totally preventable, or at least manageable, and the powers that be find every reason to avoid that -- far, far beyond the realm of sheer incompetence -- people need to ask why.

    [–]SurvivalFloating2 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    It's the same thing on Twitter. Social media is being weaponized. I'm sorry for your horrible experiences too.

    [–]HelloSummer99 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    That sub is so f*cked. Continues to be the only sub I've ever been banned from. No warning, no discourse, no appeal

    [–]SurvivalFloating2 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    It's gone through multiple iterations since it began, with different moderators affecting its direction.

    At first, it was an excellent source of information. But when the vaccines came out, it clearly became astroturfed by entities that wanted to sell vaccination as the only solution. Many people reported being banned after saying we still needed to wear masks even after being vaccinated.

    Then, for a brief moment, it was sane again. Now it's back to being "we can't make others mask, so shrug, you do you -- I'm gonna live my life like it's 2019 and pretend it's the flu." There is zero tolerance for questioning the efficacy, scheduling, or side effects of the vaccine, which is crazy. That's just normal scientific discourse.

    I find that sub very similar to r/politics, which is also heavily astroturfed by the center left. I was banned there as well. I was called "incivil" for disagreeing with someone who was talking about how great the economy is under Biden. The person who flagged me spams every thread with the same comments. They're obviously paid by the DNC or the WH or someone with an agenda. There are a bunch of accounts over there that do the same thing.

    [–][deleted]  (8 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]Grimaceisbaby 3 points4 points  (2 children)

      I worry about the damage governments have done to vaccines in general after how it’s handled MRNA.

      Most people who get long covid seemed to have the same bad reaction to vaccines as covid itself. It gets worse with every vaccine or infection. We really can’t tell which is worse because the individual response is so different.

      If tons of money was going into treating and understanding these reactions it wouldn’t be this strange mystery. They really did push them on people and now so many are left suffering. We clearly need to understand immune systems to treat urgent issues so this work needs to be done.

      I’d love to have a vaccine to protect me against future illness but if a cancer MRNA vaccine comes out I really can’t trust I won’t have this same terrible reaction. I know I’m not alone in that.

      [–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

      No. Symptoms of your immune system generation antibodies, are not synonymous to damage done by COVID creating long COVID symptoms. We know it gets worse worse with infection. People that had issues with the COVID vaccines may have had other issues with vaccines that they never knew they had. A lot of people never got flu vaccines, or regular vaccines typically received as an infant or young child. It isn't the strange mystery you're making it out to be.

      [–]Grimaceisbaby 10 points11 points  (0 children)

      It’s easy for you to say it’s not a mystery when you’re not living through this exact scenario. If it’s not a mystery why do doctors have no answers for me or what to do to keep myself safe? There’s nothing I want more than an effective vaccine. My symptoms were identical from vaccines and covid. They just got worse each time.

      Tons of hEDS and ME/CFS patients have reported issues from these vaccines. So many healthy people I know had issues from them too. It’s a new technology, why would we assume it’s already perfect for everyone?

      Everyone I talk to has been vaccinated for everything else without issue. Even if people had issues with other vaccines I’d still expect the people who are making tons of money off these to fund research into treatments to people who have been injured?

      [–]KarmaPharmacy 9 points10 points  (4 children)

      No woman loses a liter of blood, per day, for a year, completely randomly without some kind of cause. That’s why this hypothesis was come to after carefully examining all possible causes first.

      [–]NewsteadMtnMama 18 points19 points  (1 child)

      No human can replace a liter of blood a day without transfusions. My dil lost a liter after a difficult childbirth and was in ICU with transfusions.

      [–]KarmaPharmacy 6 points7 points  (0 children)

      No one said I didn’t have transfusions… what a weird thing to get hung up on.

      [–]kingofthesofas 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      yeah they would be in the hospital ICU getting multi blood transfusions if that was the case. She would likely have died in a week or less at that rate. Be skeptical of her story since she is clearly exaggerating critical details.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

      Um... a liter of blood a day? Often? Enormous blood clots? You'd have been in shock and in an ICU getting endless transfusions, or dead.

      I'm willing to believe you had a bad reaction, it happens, but maybe you were banned because your account simply isn't believable.

      [–]KarmaPharmacy 5 points6 points  (0 children)

      I don’t want to go into how bad it was or what treatments I endured because of it. I was bedridden. It was traumatic, at best.

      [–]Bennyjig 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      There’s definitely censorship on side effects for sure. But it’s a vaccine to help people not die during a pandemic. They kind of have to act like it’s always gonna be fine otherwise morons will see the 1/100000 and be like “look Cleetus I told you it changes your daggone dna”. Every vaccine can have side effects. That’s kind of the nature of them. Sorry that happened to you though.

      [–]shaggysnorlax -1 points0 points  (0 children)

      What is that, about 8 gills?

      [–]Crimsuhn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      So post your records with redacted information to prove it. Otherwise you’re just another antivax LARPER

      [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (1 child)

      Goddamn I want moth wings, ultimate prep tool. Where can I sign up?

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

      Nah. Bat wings. Moth wings are dusty and fragile. You want that skeletal support; plus bat wings are just inherently cooler.

      [–]HaveBanana 5 points6 points  (0 children)

      For the uninitiated, this is a recombinant (spike) protein vaccine. Cells are used to translate the spike protein found on the surface of the viral envelope (hemagglutinin). The vaccine is a micelle of this spike protein and adjuvant. Your body's antigen presenting immune cells uses to prepare for an infection. I'm excited for this, fuck the special interest in Pfizer.

      [–]NewsteadMtnMama 8 points9 points  (0 children)

      My husband, sons, dils, grandchildren and I have all had Moderna and Pfizer vaccines and boosters. No side effects other than a sore arm and tiredness for a day or two. Only 1 dil has had COVID and that was after she flew home from Britain - the rest of us, including grands in public schools, are among the only 25% or so of Americans who have never had COVID (and we test any time we feel ill).

      [–]paraspiral 1 point2 points  (2 children)

      I am not a hypochondriac what do I need a COVID-19 vaccine since they don't give immunity?

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      No vaccine gives immunity. So apparently you don't use vaccines at all, huh? There's a prepper for you.

      This was a Republican/Russian talking point 2 years ago and I'm surprised it's still around. The best of the bunch, measles vaccine, grants about 96% protection if you get the full series of shots. Not 100%. You can still get measles, it's just unusual.

      The Covid vaccine reduces your chance of getting Covid. Not as much; estimates have varied between 20-80%, depending on variant. What it does is help keep you out of the hospital or morgue. And that was the Covid vaccine's original goal.

      Know anyone that Covid killed? I do.

      Now be good, if dated, troll and move the goalposts and talk about side effects or something. Remember, you get extra points if you cover all the talking points! Which is why I'll block you if you try - I'm not here as any trolls platform.

      [–]Conscious-Show-7961 1 point2 points  (1 child)

      Are you going to support forced vaccinations, mass surveillance, and the ability to deem anything a global health emergency? These are all on the cutting board in May of 2024 for the WHO. Look up “International Health Regulations 2024 amendments”. This isn’t a conspiracy theory. You’re a fucking idiot and I hope you wake up sometime. But go on and trust your daddy government to protect you.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      I'd really like to know what your comment has to do with the fact that Novavax is now available. My original post was apolitical and didn't have anything in it to inspire a discussion about public heath vs individual rights. In other words, you saw the word "vaccine" and launched into what appears to be your favorite and only topic, conspiracies.

      But since you asked... I'm in the US and no politician in any party here is going to support forced vaccinations. Now, I do understand the right of businesses to require them of employees or face termination. We're mostly all employee-at-will here, which means a business can terminate your employment for any or no reason, including vaccination status. That's not a government issue; that's capitalism gone awry. Folk who have a problem with that have valid concerns, but they aren't political ones, unless they are asking government to reign in the excesses of capitalism, a discussion that doesn't belong here.

      I support the right of schools to require them of students. I know what measles can do. Don't like it? Homeschool. You always have options, you just might not like them.

      The WHO can define anything they like as anything they like. They don't set US policy. For the record, Covid-19 was an actual pandemic by anyone's definition and I had no problem with it being defined that way by either the CDC or the WHO.

      A look at your posting history really says it all. You think Biden is in cahoots with Trump; you think the jews in Israel aren't actually jews. You think the current war in Israel is fake, whatever that means, and you think there will be another pandemic in 2026. For a couple comments I thought you might be a Christian who went off the rails, but no Christian is going to start setting dates for endtimes events; we're forbidden to play that game. In short... you're just a loon with serious confusions over how the world actually works.

      Then I got to this statement of yours: "You can’t convince me WW2 wasn’t a fabrication just to give the Jews extra protection and a falsified genocide that was widely over exaggerated."

      and yeah, that was when I needed to bail. You think one of the most widely attested and researched atrocities in modern histories was somehow faked, along with millions of Covid deaths and a US election. It's easy to be a loon if you get to pick and choose what's true and false on the basis of absolutely nothing but your own hate.

      I can't decide if you're a legitimate paranoid delusional or just a poorly managed troll, but really, does it matter? Bye.

      [–]PinataofPathology 8 points9 points  (0 children)

      I trust mrna just fine but it fcks my sht up hard wrt COVID bc my immune system is an ahole so I've been waiting on this.

      [–]Poghornleghorn2 7 points8 points  (11 children)

      Lmao. 2023 years after everyone has had covid, catering to a strain of the virus that is so irrelevant that you'd be taking the shot for fun. It's become so contagious that the threat is lower than the .02% death rate that the original had.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 7 points8 points  (10 children)

      I've never had Covid. And having Covid doesn't mean you shouldn't get vaccinated; many people have had Covid several times. For some it's worse each time.

      Novavax was updated to handle recent the recent common strain of the virus.

      And your comment about it being really contagious is true but that has nothing to do with the threat being lower, plus you misquoted the original death rate.

      You got about everything wrong and yet you think you can laugh. Clueless. Sad. Bye.

      [–]Simple-Conflict7586 7 points8 points  (9 children)

      Imagine being such a coward that you 'rebuttle' then block and hide so you don't have to see anything that disagrees with your diaper baby opinion.

      You can't say, "Brand new, tested and been in trials for a while" and "Made for the recent common strain" in the same breath, unless you have 0 understanding of virology, which your following statements seem to indicate.

      Covid evolves quickly, that is why the general common cold is labelled a , "coronavirus" it develops a slight genetic change and becomes resistant to the older antibodies.

      The general rule of thumb is that, the stronger a virus is the less viral it will be. If a virus kills its host, it has minimal to no chance of continuing its life cycle and spreading to others.

      Covid has always had a .01 - .02% death rate. If you're thinking of the initial 2% death rate, that's for those with 4+ co morbidities + obesity and a vitamin D deficiency +++ including covid as a cause of death when it played little to no role in someone dying. Try to be more informed about literally anything before being a little crybaby. Idiot. Sad. Bye.

      [–]DudeLoveBaby 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      Covid has always had a .01 - .02% death rate. If you're thinking of the initial 2% death rate, that's for those with 4+ co morbidities + obesity and a vitamin D deficiency +++ including covid as a cause of death when it played little to no role in someone dying.

      Death rate =/= case fatality, which is what the 2% figure referenced to my recollection.

      1.1% case fatality per John Hopkins University; deaths per 100,000 match up more with your fabricated number. If you're truly talking about 'death rate' this entire time...

      that's for those with 4+ co morbidities + obesity and a vitamin D deficiency

      would not be relevant as death rate is for the entire population with or without covid.

      I'm happy to read any actual citations you have for any of the claims you've made, but seeing as you've spent the last year using this account as a coward burner to rant about vaccines on, I somehow doubt you have any.

      Being the strongest voice in the room doesn't mean a damn thing about how well informed you are. You are no better than a right wing AM radio host that relies on zingers instead of knowing what the fuck you're talking about, because no one who will agree with you knows what the fuck they're talking about either.

      [–]Simple-Conflict7586 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

      Typical room temp IQ redditor sprinting to find an argument where there is none.

      Yeah, I typed the first thing opposite to what was meant to be typed. The virus has become weaker as time progressed, proving the point that natural selection generally trends a virus towards being less deadly and more transmissive. Reading a little bit more than one line would clarify that.

      1% is on the high range, unless you have a very Anglocentric world view and believe Fat ass North America to be the centre of the world. Most European countries were well below 1%. Not to mention how excessively your politics inflated the number of covid deaths - https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/coronavirus/Alert-2-New-ICD-code-introduced-for-COVID-19-deaths.pdf

      https://twitter.com/chrisbergpov/status/1247680994821509121

      This isn't even close to piercing the tip of the ice berg of death inflation.

      I'm sure citations would be beneficial for you if you had some sort of semblance of an argument here? Accounts literally mean nothing on reddit, you make no point here. Most subreddits ban you for any comment about vaccine mandates being dictatorial, just make a new account. Who cares? That says nothing about character.

      Try making an educated statement, rather than being a Chenk Uyger wannabe, tossing out expletives to sound like you've made a point to your alt-left audience, while saying absolutely nothing.

      [–]IN5T1NCT48 3 points4 points  (0 children)

      Haha only edgeoffreedom knows how this all works. We are humbled by his presence /s

      [–]thisbliss4 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      Golf clapping over here

      [–]Drawdeadonk1 -3 points-2 points  (4 children)

      The general rule of thumb is that, the stronger a virus is the less viral it will be. If a virus kills its host, it has minimal to no chance of continuing its life cycle and spreading to others

      I was gonna say the same, the fact people still even consider covid a concern is truly laughable.

      [–]OttoOtter 0 points1 point  (3 children)

      That is, of course, not true, and anyone who knows anything about evolutionary biology knows that. Viruses don't trend towards anything over time. They are random and supported by whatever conditions exist at the time.

      [–]Simple-Conflict7586 0 points1 point  (2 children)

      You are of course playing semantics and I guess anyone with any real sense of scientific understanding would know that.

      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7095397/

      Here is a good proposition on the general topic of conversation here.

      YES a virus CAN mutate to become more deadly and YES there is no real TREND overtime. You took the idea of what was said and twisted it to fit your own opinion.

      ​

      "While this amazing capacity to mutate fuels the engine of evolutionary change, most mutations adversely impact some aspect of virus function and are removed by natural selection."

      Natural selection will generally push towards functionality and virality in a virus. If the method of transmission dissipates, then the virus will soon cease to exist. If there is a mutation that pushes the virus to being far more deadly and extreme, the host will likely be less exposed to others, less interactive and more in a state of seclusion, limiting opportunities for spread and continuance.

      This is perfectly exemplified throughout the trend of the coronavirus we have been talking about. As each mutation has occurred, the virus has become more deadly and far less viral.

      [–]OttoOtter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      I love that you agree with me because I'm right then try and weasel your way out of me being right by claiming it's "semantics"

      [–]DudeLoveBaby 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Bro, you're literally agreeing with this guy and you are desperate to make it sound like you aren't.

      each mutation has occurred, the virus has become more deadly and far less viral.

      You somehow even manage to be wrong here. Omicron was notably less deadly than previous strains which is why it was a different kind of concern - higher chances for more mutations - than previous strains were.

      [–]LankyGuitar6528 4 points5 points  (5 children)

      Being skeptical of a new technology like mRNA vaccines is entirely sensible. The initial testing was only on about 30K people and they rolled it out to billions of people. That was exceptionally reckless and it's just a good thing we didn't end humanity or give everybody a tail or whatever.

      That said, the mRNA having been around for a couple years and being tested on billions of people it is now very clear that the vaccines do work and, fortunately, have an excellent safety profile. I don't see the point in using the older technology at this point. Not that I can blame anybody who still isn't there yet with the new stuff.

      [–]nebulacoffeez 11 points12 points  (1 child)

      Novavax is supposedly more effective than mRNA & wanes less quickly - also specifically more effective vs. transmission, not just severe disease/death. Those are my reasons!

      [–]LankyGuitar6528 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Solid reasons

      [–]WoodsColt 6 points7 points  (1 child)

      I would've liked a tail though

      [–]LankyGuitar6528 5 points6 points  (0 children)

      Same. So long as it was prehensile.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      You always want a variety of approaches available. I don't know anyone personally who had a rough time with Moderna's mRNA vaccine, but I've heard of people who were laid up by it. They might not react the same way to something like Novavax. Choice is good.

      There was nothing reckless about the mRNA vaccine testing. They used the same approaches they used for any modern vaccine, same statistical analysis, etc. 40,000+ isn't a bad sample size - not sure where you got 30,000, seeing as Pfizer alone had 43,000 just for phase 3: https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-conclude-phase-3-study-covid-19-vaccine and that's more than most get. The mRNA vaccine for influenza, now in phase 3 testing, doesn't have that many.

      [–]Blueskies777 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

      The one thing I love most about this sub forum is that they are scientific realists, and most of us have gotten our MNRA vaccines.

      [–]Delicious-Ad1116 -4 points-3 points  (1 child)

      Vaccines are scams.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Thank you for your carefully researched opinion, complete with footnotes and citations. You clearly put a lot of study into your paid-for and meaningless opinion.

      Bye.

      [–]ScootysDad 0 points1 point  (6 children)

      Not enough data to say one thing or another. Here's the story https://www.science.org/content/article/should-you-pick-novavax-s-covid-19-shot-over-mrna-options.

      Yes, it is another alternative for those who are freaking out because they think that there are nano-particles that will turn us into zombies. Billions of shots given and 1 national emergency communication test later we're still not the Walking Deads.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 1 point2 points  (5 children)

      I follow Topol, who they quoted for that article. His basic premise is they're both generally safe and they're both generally effective and no one's done a real head-to-head study to see which one has the edge. In comparisons done so far they are roughly comparable. That's what you'd expect; one convinces your body to producing a spike protein, one delivers the spike protein directly; either way your body then learns an immunological response to that protein. Bottom line, he indicated he'd take either.

      I think it's interesting that early data suggests that Novavax might hit some people with fewer side effects; and it's promising that Novavax doesn't need to be shipped at extremely cold temperatures, so it can probably go more places. But as far as I'm concerned there's nothing to pick between them; it just ups the odds that I'll be able to get a vaccine because one or the other might be available near me and either one is fine.

      [–]tugchuggington 1 point2 points  (4 children)

      I thought mRNAs lose effectiveness quicker / Nvax sustains protections

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

      Novavax sustains protection for at least 4 months, at least in one trial. mRNA vaccines are likely about the same, in both cases the body is responding to spike protein and doesn't care where it comes from. There's probably very little difference.

      Nothing - getting Covid, mRNA vaccine, other vaccines - provides long lasting protection. It's not like measles (more or less lifetime) or even tetanus (10 years). Covid evolves around protections, something like flu.

      [–]tugchuggington 1 point2 points  (2 children)

      We need better vaccines

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

      No vaccine is ever going to confer immunity; no such thing. All you can hope for is fewer side effects, and there will always people who react to something. Maybe you could be clearer about what improvement you're looking for? Covid vaccine is successful. Measles vaccines are miraculous. Flu vaccines are a regular disappointment, but it's a tough target.

      [–]tugchuggington 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Longer lasting protection, fewer side fx, More adoption by public, Nvax + mRNA seems to grant some broader protection. Like that

      [–]Darkwing___Duck -2 points-1 points  (6 children)

      For what purpose? At this point it's no more dangerous than flu, and I've never had a flu shot nor do I see a good reason for it.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 4 points5 points  (5 children)

      https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2803749

      Covid is still about twice as fatal as the flu. Want to try again on that "Covid is not more dangerous than the flu" assertion?

      And one reason covid's fatality has decreased is because the vaccine is effective at preventing death.

      It may not be dangerous to you; it depends a lot on your age and any underlying factors. I knew a guy who was 55 and fairly healthy and Covid killed him. I know a 90 year old woman who breezed through both the flu and pneumonia. If you're 30 maybe you don't care about either; but talk to someone who has long covid.

      [–]Darkwing___Duck 0 points1 point  (4 children)

      It may not be dangerous to you; it depends a lot on your age and any underlying factors.

      Precisely.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

      Um... yay you? You'll be in a different category someday; everyone will be unless they happen to die young. Not sure why you bothered to comment. You do you. Here's hoping it doesn't earn you a Herman Cain award.

      [–]Darkwing___Duck 1 point2 points  (1 child)

      Here's hoping it doesn't earn you a Herman Cain award.

      But of course you'd be one of those.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      | one of those.

      A friend of mine, mid-50s, no serious known health issues, didn't think Covid was a big deal. Didn't bother with masks. This was before the vaccine came out, but given his politics I don't think he'd have bothered with the vaccine anyway.

      It wasn't a good death.

      It just has to happen once, to someone you know well. Then you become one of those. Here's hoping it's not how you learn, but it's how a lot of people learned.

      Done here.

      [–]OttoOtter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Hopefully you at least have the decency to not expose everyone to whatever germs you have when you are sick.

      [–]DrGoatsePHD -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

      i got the jba and no my wifi is fuck god dammit biden

      [–]okiedokie321 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      Should I still get the Novavax (my 4th) if my COVID antibodies still show over 4000?

      I'm 2x Pfizer and 1x Moderna. I like to diversify, because every vaccine targets a specific part of the virus.

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      I'm not a doctor. Novavax targets a recent form of Covid that maybe your previous ones don't, so there may be some advantage to it. But I'd ask an actual doctor to figure it out.

      [–]Sea-Boysenberry3087 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      So serious question though- why do we call it a vaccine, if you can still catch the virus?

      [–]OnTheEdgeOfFreedom[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      If it was a serious question, you'd have used a websearch and gotten the answer yourself.

      Since you're either incapable or just a troll using out of date talking points, I'll try to explain simply.

      No vaccine - against any disease - ever guarantees you won't get that disease. None are 100%. A 3 shot series of the measles vaccine gets you to 96% and it's the best of the bunch. Most are far worse. Flu hits about 60% in a good year (and it lasts maybe 4 months). The first Covid vaccine did better than that vs the alpha variant, worse vs omicron. Mumps IIRC is about 88%.

      If you insist that a vaccine means you cannot ever get the associated disease, then there has never been a vaccine. And never will be.

      EDIT: you've been posting some variation of this foolish question for 2 years, and despite the fact that your question is answered by many sources, never looked it up. You don't post often enough to be a troll, so you're just a fool. Bye.

      [–]MrsClaire07 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Just got mine today at my local Costco, No appointment needed!