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Over 11,700 Mesothelioma patients sue Johnson & Johnson for selling talcum powder contaminated with asbestos. (reuters.com)

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[–]sirboddingtons 3641 points3642 points  (200 children)

Just to mention,

Thousands of people are dying or have died because a company, Johnson and Johnson, has covered up since 1957 evidence of high rates, 3% of total content, containing asbestos fibers in a product designed for infants to adults but primarily marketed towards infants.

INFANTS.

This is horrendous.

[–]Arctic_Chilean 1191 points1192 points  (126 children)

If profits aren't going to be severly impacted, then the majority of shareholders won't care. I hope the justice system has enough of a backbone to go after these sociopaths.

[–]mcurl67 78 points79 points  (47 children)

Well the stock has plunged 9 percent so far today

[–]MrIronGolem27 119 points120 points  (45 children)

Let's try 90%

[–]LittleFalls 139 points140 points  (43 children)

Here's a list of all their name brands. https://m.ranker.com/list/johnson-and-johnson-brands/werner-brandes

If you want to boycott, it's quite a long list.

[–]Arctic_Chilean 214 points215 points  (29 children)

And that's the problem. The consumer has next to no say in a corporations policies. They could literally be killing babies and using their bones as talcum powder, but if the majority of shareholdera are ok with it and the Justice system gives them a slap on the wrist, they'll keep doing fucked up shit. They take calculated decisions when doing fucked up shit. What would get them more profit? Cleaning up their production line and avoid fines, lawsuits + bad PR... OR knowingly continuing poisining their consumers and accepting the future fines, lawsuits and bad PR? Morality is completely absent from these corporations. They simply do not act in the best interest of the consumer or of humanity. They are completely disconnected from the real world. All they see are gains and losses. They no longer posses any humanity, and if they ever pretend to, it's just PR. This is the world we live in folks.

[–]officeDrone87 91 points92 points  (11 children)

This is part of my problem when libertarians tell me "the free market will keep companies from doing bad things". Without any regulating agencies, it would be even harder to keep these companies accountable (and it's already hard enough).

For example, without regulation, how does the free market punish a company for dumping toxic waste into the water supply?

[–]Klarok 51 points52 points  (5 children)

You're meant to sue them...

Yes, sue the multinational that can bury you in an army of lawyers. I'm sure that'll work.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

A single person gets buried, a single lawyer in a class action gets buried. A multinational responds to millions of small claims gets buried. It worked for Scientologists didn't it? And they wrecked the US government that way. OOh I wanna see the legal DDOS happen once more!

[–]BEEF_WIENERS 12 points13 points  (1 child)

The problem here is that as you start describing such an organization that would organize people to do this, because unorganized the people will never do this, as you describe what this thing does and how the actual mechanics of the thing would operate the more and more it sounds like a government.

[–]TheKingCrimsonWorld 8 points9 points  (1 child)

I've heard many people argue about how things would be great if we just left them to the free market, but they can never explain why it would be better than what we have now. The current system in the US is shitty in plenty of different ways, but I've yet to hear a compelling argument or even an explanation for how a total laissez-faire policy would actually fix or improve anything.

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    [–]wastingtoomuchthyme 54 points55 points  (2 children)

    And the "fines" for breaking the law are ALWAYS less than the profit they made by breaking the law.

    [–]cool110110 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    That's what the whole 4% of last year's global turnover thing in GDPR is trying to address.

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      [–]hamburgular70 10 points11 points  (0 children)

      Include in that workers. Same deal. They don't have a responsibility to their workers over shareholders.

      [–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

      Well said and terrifying

      [–]e2therock 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      Whats even more insidious is how we all (me included) have become complicit in the crimes of these corporations. My iphone was basically made by slaves, but damn I love it. All of the people that work for these companies that pollute and poison us and the environment collect a paycheck soaked in blood, but what choice do they have? This is the real reason nothing changes.

      It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it.

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        [–]PKPhyre 29 points30 points  (2 children)

        This is why socialists say thing like there isn't ethical consumption under capitalism. So much product is controlled by so few corporations effective boycotting is nigh impossible. "Voting with your wallet" is the greatest lie the corporate class has ever sold, these practices can only be changed with top-down legislation.

        [–]LittleFalls 22 points23 points  (0 children)

        No kidding! I've been trying to boycott Nestle ever since the 90s, and I'm still accidentally buying their products. They are treating crops, even organic, with treated frack wastewater in CA, so I can't buy wine or produce from there now. Johnson and Johnson is out, so there's another list of brands I have to try to remember. I'm going to have grow all my own food and start having to weave my own cloth before long.

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          [–]Midwestern_Childhood 16 points17 points  (2 children)

          Just look at the number of everyday items on the list that you're likely to find in many households. This is an abbreviated list of just the ones I knew:

          Acuvue, Aveeno, Band-Aid, Benadryl, Bengay, Cortaid, Efferdent, Imodium, K-Y, Lactaid, Listermint, Lubriderm, Luden's, Monistat, Modess, Motrin, Mylanta, Neosporin, Neutrogena, Nicoderm, Nicorette, O.B., Pepcid, Polysporin, Rolaids, Shower to Shower, Sinutab, Splenda, Stayfree, Sudafed, Tylenol Baby, Tylenol Children, Visine

          That's a list a lot of people will have trouble boycotting for pragmatic reasons.

          [–]Khar-Selim 8 points9 points  (1 child)

          so basically don't buy name-brand pharmaceuticals

          [–]dontsuckmydick 8 points9 points  (0 children)

          Phew! Good thing I can't afford them!

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                [–]DethRaid 24 points25 points  (2 children)

                Exactly. Unless the amount Johnson and Johnson has to pay is a huge percentage of their profits, they'll just do it again knowing that they can spend half a century poising children and still make a profit

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                  [–]Mmaibl1 85 points86 points  (6 children)

                  Dont worry itll be ok. They will issue a public apology and fire the CEO, as per usual nowadays. After that they will rebrand themselves as the new and improved Johnson & Johnson, so people will forgive them...only to be shocked when something like this inevitably pops up again in the future.

                  [–]Arctic_Chilean 26 points27 points  (2 children)

                  All because we live in a society run by people that prioritize profit over humanity, and we have a justice system that empowers their depraved insanity for ever increasing profit margins.

                  [–]Dhiox 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                  And the fired CEO gets 5 million dollars as severance, and they get immediately rehired by another multi-million dollar company, and continue to make more a year than some do in decades, or even their whole lives.

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                    [–]internetmeme 65 points66 points  (22 children)

                    Sorry I’m genuinely curious how the product wasn’t tested by the public or an independent lab to verify 3% asbestos in over 50 years? Asbestos testing is easy and common. This should have been verified decades ago and known by everyone.

                    [–]Crede777 30 points31 points  (1 child)

                    Maybe someone more familiar with the approval process for OTC's and things like talcum powder can chime in.

                    But I think back in the 50's, government regulation of this stuff was rare. It wasn't until later that the FDA stepped in and started requiring companies to show that their product was safe. Naturally, they granted exceptions for products which were GRAS or Generally Recognized As Safe. Things which had been widely used for a long time and had no known problems. I would bet talcum powder was GRAS and so was granted an exception.

                    Edit - Apparently the FDA doesn't test cosmetics (which talcum powder is) unless there is scientific evidence that it might be harmful. So the opposite of what they do for foods.

                    [–]Jajaninetynine 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                    Australian government tests nothing unless there's suspicions. A competitor might have something tested privately. There's a magazine that does some random testing of stuff, but other than that there's not a lot of quality control.

                    [–]DJ_Velveteen 85 points86 points  (10 children)

                    Hi, lab analyst here.

                    As it turns out, there's all kinds of consumer products that don't really get tested, especially topicals.

                    Also, since it's always worth saying: "Organic" doesn't mean "pesticide-free."

                    [–]AllegedyBroccoli[🍰] 18 points19 points  (7 children)

                    Nicotine is an organic pesticide.

                    [–]Nighthawk700 21 points22 points  (5 children)

                    Nicotine in typical doses is not much worse than caffeine (also a plant defense). It's the tar, combustion compounds, and elements/chemicals absorbed by the tobacco plant that are the problem.

                    [–]__WhiteNoise 15 points16 points  (2 children)

                    Nicotine's usefulness as a stimulant is hindered by its potency(much easier to accidentally be poisoned), its cardiovascular/angiogenic side effects, its short duration of effect, and its withdrawal effects.

                    And of course, combustion byproducts from smoking have nothing to do with the fact that nicotine is used as an "organic certified" pesticide.

                    [–]AllegedyBroccoli[🍰] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                    Absolutely. And not to say caffeine isn’t bad for you either, but it’s about perception. I’d imagine many people who only eat organic wouldn’t encourage nicotine being sprayed on their foods.

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                        [–]quats5 3 points4 points  (1 child)

                        Or that it’s healthy, either. Poison ivy is typically organic and all natural....

                        [–]DJ_Velveteen 6 points7 points  (0 children)

                        I love that photo of a sandwich board outside some business that reads "SOME THINGS THAT ARE GLUTEN FREE: LEAD. COCAINE. URANIUM"

                        [–]overgme 15 points16 points  (1 child)

                        Asbestos lawyer here . . .

                        One of the problems with talc in particular is that you need a really, really powerful microscope to see the asbestos fibers in it, as they tend to be smaller than most asbestos fibers you find in other kinds of products.

                        Of course, Johnson and Johnson knew about this fact decades ago. Yet they still, to this day, squawk about EPA testing that used insufficiently powerful microscopes.

                        They also defend their lawsuits by saying the asbestos in their talc isn't really asbestos, it's just "cleavage fragments."

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                          [–]ThirstyOne 41 points42 points  (4 children)

                          3%? That's not enough. We demand more asbestos!

                          [–]caninehere 14 points15 points  (3 children)

                          If I'm paying for asbestos, I at least want my money's worth!

                          [–]fatandsad1 8 points9 points  (2 children)

                          for your ass hole too, they haven't been putting it in powder for foot rash, no it's mainly used for babies assholes

                          [–]AlpineCoder 21 points22 points  (1 child)

                          Truth be told, I can't think of a better way they could have prepared us for the real world than blowing asbestos up our ass.

                          [–]I_Luv_Trump 40 points41 points  (14 children)

                          But Trump said that fears around asbestos were actually just part of a big mob conspiracy... 🤔

                          [–]p_mud 26 points27 points  (0 children)

                          It’s not dangerous unless it becomes airborne and people are around to breath it. Wait...

                          [–]rareas 22 points23 points  (10 children)

                          That's because Russia is by far the world's largest producer of asbestos.

                          Russia: 1,050,000 metric tons.

                          China: 420,000 metric tons.

                          Brazil: 307,000 metric tons.

                          Kazakhstan: 242,000 metric tons.

                          India: 240 metric tons.

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                              [–]niceguybadboy 698 points699 points  (107 children)

                              As someone who uses Talcum powder daily: wow.

                              [–]Kasper1000[S] 418 points419 points  (42 children)

                              Yeah, unfortunately I have a lot of family overseas that use talcum powder on a daily basis too, they’re absolutely horrified to hear this.

                              [–]EddieTheEcho 71 points72 points  (40 children)

                              For what? What’s a daily use for that stuff?

                              [–]centizen24 284 points285 points  (3 children)

                              swamp ass

                              [–][deleted] 109 points110 points  (0 children)

                              All that does is make fairy paste

                              [–]StinkinFinger 19 points20 points  (1 child)

                              I had to quit drinking all forms of caffeine to get rid of mine. I’d almost prefer being dead.

                              [–]BeefKnuckleback 9 points10 points  (0 children)

                              Cutting out HFCS worked for me.

                              [–]Kasper1000[S] 115 points116 points  (29 children)

                              India’s hot as hell, so the talcum powder helps absorb sweat and blocks body odor.

                              [–]jld2k6 25 points26 points  (11 children)

                              You can also rub it into your hair to absorb the grease and act as a sort of dry shampoo

                              [–]threehundredthousand 78 points79 points  (9 children)

                              I know a number of musky stank ass people who believe that. Talcum powder is not a replacement for deodorant.

                              [–]throwawater 15 points16 points  (3 children)

                              No but if you use both it's quite nice.

                              [–]LumpyShitstring 22 points23 points  (2 children)

                              Except for the asbestos.

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                                  [–]TheGardenNymph 27 points28 points  (0 children)

                                  It helps with chaffing

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                                      [–]TheGardenNymph 27 points28 points  (3 children)

                                      My parents still use it, and now my mum is upset because she used it on my brothers and I when we were babies, and she had no idea it was dangerous

                                      [–]LassieMcToodles 17 points18 points  (0 children)

                                      Not only was it used on me as a baby back in the 70s, a few of my dolls actually came with little bottles of the powder.

                                      So, that's awesome.

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                                        [–]Khourieat 59 points60 points  (33 children)

                                        Wait they still use talc for baby powder? I thought everyone had converted over to cornstarch decades ago!

                                        [–]buttmunchr69 7 points8 points  (6 children)

                                        I have a newborn and use none of these, am I doing it wrong?

                                        [–]Radrezzz 26 points27 points  (0 children)

                                        I was told in my new parent class not to bother with the stuff. It's called "baby powder" but it's not really for babies. Glad I listened to them.

                                        [–]jerrysugarav 17 points18 points  (2 children)

                                        It's absolutely unnecessary. If you have a good butt cream you're fine.

                                        [–]Khourieat 16 points17 points  (0 children)

                                        Nah, man, fine particulates are shitty for their lungs.

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                                          [–]internetmeme 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                                          What the hell? Who does that?

                                          [–]Orleanian 9 points10 points  (0 children)

                                          A lot of folk use cornstarch as a talc alternative for dryness and the easing of rashes with babies.

                                          [–]AltSpRkBunny 21 points22 points  (13 children)

                                          It’s been known for awhile that women who use baby powder on their inner thighs and general nether regions are at much higher risk for developing cervical cancer. If you’re a guy who regularly uses baby powder in the same areas, I’d think twice about having sex with you.

                                          [–]nicolauz 7 points8 points  (11 children)

                                          Is the cancer causing stuff still used?! Wtf.

                                          [–]AltSpRkBunny 20 points21 points  (9 children)

                                          Don’t. Use. Talcum powder. We were gifted some when our first kid was born and never used it. My mom used it for years and had a hysterectomy due to ovarian cancer at the age of 45. Just Google it. All you need to prevent diaper rash is to dry off the baby’s butt with a towel before you put the new diaper on, and change them more often. Boudreaux’s butt paste for treating diaper rash is the goddamned bomb. Baby powder is not necessary. Our kids are now 10 and 5 years old and have never had baby powder used on them.

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                                                [–]IHeartmyshihtzu 923 points924 points  (16 children)

                                                They may be entitled to financial compensation!

                                                [–]Bouncing_Cloud 13 points14 points  (1 child)

                                                Just when you think all those firms are on their last legs, this goldmine suddenly pops up,

                                                [–]IHeartmyshihtzu 9 points10 points  (0 children)

                                                "It's a Christmas Miracle!"

                                                baby powder falls from sky

                                                [–]Lolfailban 16 points17 points  (2 children)

                                                $50 for pain and suffering... Pre tax. Uncle Sam still needs his cut

                                                [–]inuvash255 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                                                Especially that one lady from "My Strange Addiction".

                                                [–]imaginary_num6er 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                                                Does it come with “Meso-book”?

                                                [–]Da_Apple_Jacks 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                                                I'm Peter Francis Geraci

                                                To all the Chicago folks who know what this means

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                                                  [–][deleted] 387 points388 points  (18 children)

                                                  Even if it’s just trace amounts of asbestos, it’s pretty messed up that unbeknownst to them; parents are rubbing this on their new born children. Carniogens from day one.

                                                  [–]bonyponyride 39 points40 points  (1 child)

                                                  3% is way way way too much.

                                                  [–]Digitalapathy 11 points12 points  (0 children)

                                                  I prefer a 1% alternative brand.

                                                  [–]God_Damnit_Nappa 27 points28 points  (4 children)

                                                  Especially since there's no safe level of asbestos exposure. Just a little bit can be dangerous.

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                                                    [–]StudlySloth 202 points203 points  (8 children)

                                                    I just want to make clear that you have a far higher chance of developing lung cancer as opposed to mesothelioma from asbestos exposure.

                                                    The reason mesothelioma is all over those law advertisements is because it’s easier to point to asbestos as the direct cause, as opposed to the numerous causes of lung cancer (smoking obviously). Mesothelioma is so rare compared to lung cancer.

                                                    So there are many more people with lung cancer due to the baby powder that won’t get compensation since they got the “wrong cancer”.

                                                    EDIT: This is a crazy inaccurate title. It’s not 11,000 mesothelioma patients. It’s mostly ovarian cancer with a few mesothelioma patients sprinkled in. My original comment still stands though.

                                                    [–]stoobertb 34 points35 points  (7 children)

                                                    The reason mesothelioma is all over those law advertisements is because it’s easier to point to asbestos as the direct cause

                                                    Isn't mesothelioma ONLY caused by asbestos inhalation and thus the diagnosis guarantees asbestos exposure?

                                                    [–]isikorsky 28 points29 points  (2 children)

                                                    The majority of cases are from exposure (80% according to that study), but there are other factors.

                                                    [–]dman4835 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                                                    The 80% figure comes from a much older study: http://erj.ersjournals.com/content/erj/9/9/1932.full.pdf

                                                    And importantly, that study only looked at known occupational exposure. There are many other contexts in which a person could be exposed to asbestos from natural or man-made sources, and these are actually becoming relatively more common as occupational exposure has been getting more rare.

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                                                      [–]StudlySloth 18 points19 points  (1 child)

                                                      It’s dangerous to use the words “only” and “always” in medicine. But for lawsuit purposes, yeah mesothelioma=asbestos exposure.

                                                      [–]Mazerrr 17 points18 points  (1 child)

                                                      Future mesothelioma cases might come from the researchers studying carbon-nano-tubes (CNTs) as a "miracle material" over the past 10 years.

                                                      CNTs have the same "spear-like" dimensions as asbestos and are equally un-degradable by the immune system. The dimensions of asbestos let them reach the distal lung and are implicated as a cause of the abnormal cell response.

                                                      source

                                                      [–][deleted] 31 points32 points  (0 children)

                                                      When I was studying engineering, I took a class on materials. We discussed CNTs one day, and my peers were gushing over all of the possible applications. I suggested that it would be prudent for companies to do extensive research into the biological effects before using them widely and compared them to asbestos, which was the "magic mineral" of its day. I was promptly called "anti-progress."

                                                      Silly me thinking we should learn from our past mistakes.

                                                      [–]donaldfranklinhornii 166 points167 points  (26 children)

                                                      Is this still a problem? Should I stop using baby powder now?

                                                      [–]Kasper1000[S] 205 points206 points  (16 children)

                                                      J&J, and a lot of other companies, already make Talcum-free baby powder. It’s made from cornstarch and is safe to use.

                                                      [–][deleted] 49 points50 points  (13 children)

                                                      Why is there a need for baby powder?

                                                      I'm not well informed in baby stuff.

                                                      [–]orbitaldan 114 points115 points  (1 child)

                                                      The fine powder has two purposes: First, it helps keep the skin dry, which is important when babies wet themselves. Second, it acts as a dry lubricant to allow the edges of the diaper to slide over the skin without rubbing much - otherwise the diaper would chafe and irritate the skin quite badly over time.

                                                      [–]Radrezzz 25 points26 points  (0 children)

                                                      Even before this there was debate over the benefits of baby powder, e.g. https://www.verywellfamily.com/is-baby-powder-safe-for-babies-4064708

                                                      [–][deleted] 30 points31 points  (2 children)

                                                      Say you have a kilo of coke and you want to make 2 kilos of sellable product..

                                                      [–]mechmind 26 points27 points  (0 children)

                                                      Wow, I wonder how many blow enthusiasts developed lung cancer from talcum cut coke

                                                      [–]milkcrate_house 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                                                      mmmm, asbestos up your nose

                                                      [–]squirrelbomb 21 points22 points  (3 children)

                                                      Diaper rash.

                                                      [–]ThrowawayBox9000 7 points8 points  (2 children)

                                                      Adults also use it. For example, if I let moisture sit under my boobs, like if I get sweaty at work, it can cause an infection and serious skin irritation.

                                                      [–]HyperboleHelper 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                                                      Be careful if you do get an infection under the breast. It is usually a yeast infection (little bits of yeast just end up everywhere!) and cornstarch is food for it. Your doctor can prescribe a cream or powder to clear it right up.

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                                                          [–]BrisklyBrusque 33 points34 points  (8 children)

                                                          Switch to the corn starch based powder. It’s more sustainable anyway.

                                                          [–]rosekayleigh 20 points21 points  (1 child)

                                                          Burt's Bees makes a good one. It smells like honey. I used it on my babies.

                                                          [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (5 children)

                                                          What about gold bond powder? Does it have asbestos?

                                                          [–]PlayingNightcrawlers 28 points29 points  (4 children)

                                                          Mine lists talc as an inactive ingredient. If talc contains asbestos then the answer is yes. Unless modern talc products have found a way to eliminate traces of asbestos from talc I’d assume there’s some in there. Maybe someone more informed can elaborate.

                                                          [–]Jetstreamisgone 34 points35 points  (2 children)

                                                          Talc and asbestos form under similar conditions. Separating them would be like separating needles from a needlestack

                                                          [–]cowbear42 21 points22 points  (1 child)

                                                          So I should use a big magnet?

                                                          [–]kiwikish 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                                                          A small magnet should do. Take one by mouth twice a day with food.

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                                                            [–]Isperia165 74 points75 points  (7 children)

                                                            Mesothelioma is not a cureable cancer btw once you get it you are going to 100% die from it. That is what killed my father.

                                                            [–]abcdfghijklm 17 points18 points  (3 children)

                                                            I just lost my brother this Wednesday from mesothelioma. He was 29 and it was just about to be the 1 year anniversary of his diagnosis. I'm sorry for your loss.

                                                            [–]ThatsJustUn-American 6 points7 points  (1 child)

                                                            I'm so sorry to hear that. I wish it weren't so soon after your brother passed but would you mind clarifying something? My impression was that mesothelioma only affected older people who had been exposed to asbestos over a long period and in sizable amounts. I'm sure this makes you feel uncomfortable but do you know how someone so young developed it?

                                                            [–]abcdfghijklm 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                                                            We're actually not sure how he developed it. We were thinking it was from my mom's pottery (the bisque can contain asbestos. It could also be from when my mom's college was doing asbestos removal. He was a toddler at that time. The youngest case his surgeon had seen was 13 years old.

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                                                              [–]Kasper1000[S] 31 points32 points  (2 children)

                                                              I’m so sorry for your loss. I’ve only ever seen a case of Mesothelioma once in medical school, and I’ll never forget seeing how much pain that patient was in. This cancer is completely preventable, there is no reason for us to keep using asbestos in anything after knowing about its dangers.

                                                              [–]TooShiftyForYou 301 points302 points  (21 children)

                                                              They put profits over the safety of people, including children. There should be criminal punishment for such reckless behavior.

                                                              [–]i420ComputeIt 46 points47 points  (6 children)

                                                              Yeah that'll totally happen

                                                              [–]avaslash 12 points13 points  (0 children)

                                                              It will happen to some poor lamb they send to the slaughter but the lead execs will be fine.

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                                                                  [–]TheStormBird 55 points56 points  (3 children)

                                                                  Im suddenly left wondering if that lady on My Strange Addictions that snorts/eats talcum powder is okay...

                                                                  [–]Barnabi20 61 points62 points  (0 children)

                                                                  Even without the asbestos, I’d say probably not

                                                                  [–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (1 child)

                                                                  I love where your mind went... prayers for Talc Lady.

                                                                  [–]tezoatlipoca 200 points201 points  (155 children)

                                                                  Asbestos? Since when is this a thing again? I thought we did away with all the asbestos like 20 years ago.

                                                                  Well I do not care for this new Asbestos, and you may quote me on that.

                                                                  [–]Kasper1000[S] 232 points233 points  (49 children)

                                                                  Asbestos is routinely being found in Talc, since Talc and Asbestos are often found in the same mines. The talc is processed into a powder form, and easily inhaled by people who use it every day. So while we don’t use it in construction anymore, people are getting Asbestos in their lungs through freaking baby powder, of all things.

                                                                  [–]MajorLazy 74 points75 points  (23 children)

                                                                  So while we don’t use it in construction anymore

                                                                  Asbestos is not banned, it's use is regulated but it's still being used.

                                                                  [–]Dreshna 68 points69 points  (22 children)

                                                                  And the Cheeto in Chief wants to end even that...

                                                                  [–]Black_Jesus 14 points15 points  (2 children)

                                                                  Just thinking of Kevin Garnett throwing talcum powder in the air before every game ... Smh

                                                                  [–]looncraz 12 points13 points  (0 children)

                                                                  I have been suspicious about baby powder since forever... Powders are almost always unsafe when inhaled unless they are water soluble.

                                                                  [–]bexamous 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                                                                  in their lungs

                                                                  And in their ovaries.

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                                                                    [–]PloppyCheesenose 34 points35 points  (3 children)

                                                                    Asbestos is a type of mineral. If you mine something like talc, you may get asbestos with it.

                                                                    [–]fulloftrivia 16 points17 points  (2 children)

                                                                    It's 6 different minerals, actually.

                                                                    [–]Jetstreamisgone 12 points13 points  (1 child)

                                                                    More than 6. We only identify the 6 most common forms in a lab setting

                                                                    [–]jschubart 109 points110 points  (31 children)

                                                                    Moved to Lemm.ee -- mass edited with redact.dev

                                                                    [–]caninehere 51 points52 points  (0 children)

                                                                    "Syphilis is harmless! I've had it for thirty years and frankly, I've got the biggest lymph nodes, I'm telling you, biggest you've ever seen."

                                                                    [–]WingerRules[🍰] 101 points102 points  (3 children)

                                                                    Coincidentally, by far the worlds largest producer of asbestos is Russia.

                                                                    [–]yeesCubanB 54 points55 points  (2 children)

                                                                    That's such a coincidental coinidence.

                                                                    [–]nacr0n 10 points11 points  (1 child)

                                                                    It's like a collusion of coincidence

                                                                    [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

                                                                    More asbestos! More asbestos! More asbestos!

                                                                    [–]I_Luv_Trump 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                                                                    Construction lobby and the mob.

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                                                                      [–]Shotgunfire1 15 points16 points  (0 children)

                                                                      Trump changed an epa policy from banning asbestos to allowing it to be used in a case by case basis

                                                                      [–]TheLightningbolt 86 points87 points  (10 children)

                                                                      It's about to make a big comeback. Trump's EPA is deregulating asbestos. I fucking hate the republican party.

                                                                      ‘Approved by Donald Trump’: Asbestos sold by Russian company is branded with the president’s face

                                                                      [–]I_Luv_Trump 24 points25 points  (0 children)

                                                                      Yep, Trump has long been pro asbestos. Constantly praising it and claiming dangers were faked by the mob.

                                                                      He even claimed everything would have been okay on 9/11 if there was more asbestos in the buildings.

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                                                                        [–]stoopkid13 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                                                                        One of J&Js arguments is that all the big asbestos players from the 70s and 80s have been litigated to death, so now plaintiffs firms are going after talc powder companies, like J&J and Cashmere Bouqeut.

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                                                                          [–]donfelicedon2 64 points65 points  (0 children)

                                                                          J&J didn’t tell the FDA that at least three tests by three different labs from 1972 to 1975 had found asbestos in its talc – in one case at levels reported as “rather high.”

                                                                          They probably just forgot. I mean, who hasn't forgotten to take out the same frozen pizza from the oven once, twice or thrice over a period of three years?

                                                                          [–][deleted] 22 points23 points  (5 children)

                                                                          How have we not run out of mesothelioma people yet? Those ads have been running since the 80s.

                                                                          [–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (1 child)

                                                                          It was in use for a long time (and still is in some countries) and in a lot of different applications. Even if it has been banned, it's still around. For example, those of us who grew up in homes or went to schools built pre-ban in the US may have been exposed to asbestos fibers used in things like textured paint. We won't know for another couple of decades if we have just the wrong combination of exposure and genetic susceptibility to develop mesothelioma.

                                                                          [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

                                                                          It can take up to 50 years for onset of symptoms.

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                                                                            [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (5 children)

                                                                            what the hell, ive been putting this stuff on my balls for a long time.. how recently has the asbestos been in it?

                                                                            [–]Lips2227 25 points26 points  (1 child)

                                                                            I was diagnosed with peritoneal mesothelioma when i was 29. I am 34 now. A year of hell but chemo has let me get back to a normal life. I tried to sue, 2 lawyers, neither could figure out exactly where my exposure to asbestos came from so they dropped me. It will bother me forever not knowing how i obtained this death sentence

                                                                            [–]WellSpreadMustard 87 points88 points  (11 children)

                                                                            J&J should cease to exist for this and the executives that were involved jailed but I'm sure the pocket change sized fine they'll get instead will still hurt super bad.

                                                                            [–]Nazism_Was_Socialism 13 points14 points  (3 children)

                                                                            It’s just part of the costs of doing business, that’s all

                                                                            [–]redopz 13 points14 points  (2 children)

                                                                            It's true. ~12,000 plus what knows how many more lives will equate to a relatively small fine they'll just shake off

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                                                                              [–]Ediolon 7 points8 points  (0 children)

                                                                              When people uphold the "free market" as a self regulating system, they are right. The "free market" is self regulating, but the only outcome that really matters is profit, it self regulates to maximize that outcome.

                                                                              There is also a delusional amount of optimism in the actions of people on the part of some "free market" supporters. They think people are good, not evil, so the overall outcome of a group will be largely good and beneficial. However, look at the Stanford prison experiments. This is what can happen when people let authority, power, and desire for a goal outweighs all other concerns.

                                                                              [–]Atheistmetoo 104 points105 points  (14 children)

                                                                              From what I’ve read, 1-3 batches tested at 3% and they weren’t released. The spec for batch release appears to be 0.03%... at least from 1970 or so on. If I’m understanding it correctly, that means each batch or “run” was tested and was destroyed if it was over 0.03% contaminated.. ... this seems to be an over reaction. 0.03% asbestos by volume is essentially nothing. How are they correlating that quantity with cancer?

                                                                              Keep in mind, lawyers love this shit too. Especially if it’s a huge company implicated in potential harm to children.. they eat this shit up looking for a pay day.

                                                                              I think I’ll wait to see some more actual data before I grab a pitch fork.

                                                                              [–]isikorsky 18 points19 points  (1 child)

                                                                              I think I’ll wait to see some more actual data before I grab a pitch fork.

                                                                              For the Mesothelioma cases, they plaintiffs would have to prove that the Talc was the sole contributor. The juries have been split on this that the talc caused this. Didn't read the cases, so not sure why some said yes and some said no.

                                                                              The question is the link to ovarian cancer. Here again, the juries have been split. This is a tough hill to climb since there doesn't seem to be definitive data linking the two (iaw - smoking is linked to about 80-90% of lung cancer death. If you smoke, your are 15-30 times more likely to die of lung cancer) If talc was a primary cause of ovarian cancer then the data should show a high number of lifetime talc users with ovarian cancer.

                                                                              [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

                                                                              It's sad but also hilarious that we let juries of randomly selected dipshits literally vote on how valid science is.

                                                                              I'm reminded of those geologists in Italy who got jailed for failing to predict an earthquake.

                                                                              If the incidence is so low that a causal relationship would be impossible to prove, then why is there even a case at all? This is where we're headed as a society, I guess. This thread is mostly hysterical idiots pledging bloody revenge over what appears to be nothing.

                                                                              ​

                                                                              [–]TonofSoil 14 points15 points  (1 child)

                                                                              Anything over 1% asbestos is considered ACM or asbestos containing material. So yeah 0.03% is really nothing.

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                                                                                [–]Bestoftherest222 11 points12 points  (0 children)

                                                                                At some point and time J&J did the math and figured it was more profitable to continue to use asbestos with talcum powder. Their math probably concluded that most people would either be dead or not know it was baby powder that caused an issue.

                                                                                Much like how Firestone did the math and figured a few hundred deaths from defective tires was worth it.

                                                                                [–]Mr_Infinity 10 points11 points  (1 child)

                                                                                My grandma was a pediatric nurse and died of lung cancer. There’s a significant correlation between pediatric nurses and lung cancer. Fuck these people.

                                                                                [–]Peng15 22 points23 points  (4 children)

                                                                                I think Trump is allowing abestos to be legal again.

                                                                                [–]tomato-bisque 26 points27 points  (0 children)

                                                                                #MAGA

                                                                                Make Asbestos Great Again

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                                                                                  [–]BlueDragon101 6 points7 points  (0 children)

                                                                                  If you or a loved one has been diagnosed with mesothelioma you may be entitled to financial compensation.

                                                                                  [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

                                                                                  People ITT will be pissed when they learn about construction and insulation materials sourced from China...

                                                                                  Edit:

                                                                                  I've been banned for some arbitrary reason...

                                                                                  Tile gets damaged daily. The amount of asbestos that you are exposed to is virtually unchanged because of Chinese imports.

                                                                                  Chinese imports of pet food only decreased because thousands of pets were sickened/killed.

                                                                                  [–]tapac333 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                                                                                  Its a good thing Trump made it Legal to introduce Asbethos back into products again this year... Like drywall. Yay?

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