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[–]Shesalabmix 2010 points2011 points  (199 children)

How is mandatory overtime legal?

[–]slicktommycochrane 1742 points1743 points  (40 children)

Steadily eroded workers rights and most of the power in this country concentrated in a group of 1% oligarchs?

[–]tophatpainter 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Not just eroded workers rights but the building of a work culture where surviving these kinds of work conditions is a moral badge of honor. Obviously there has begun a steady push back against that but its still ingrained in our society that you're supposedly just a better person if you work yourself to death for your boss.

[–]AliensatemyPenguin 137 points138 points  (60 children)

I don’t know, but on the warning notices at my job one of the violations is refusing to work overtime. But I’ve never heard of anyone being written up for it.

[–]funktopus 96 points97 points  (16 children)

I was once told on a Friday around 6 that I had to be at work Saturday at 6AM. I was supposed to leave at 3:30 that Friday but got the project we were working on done. I told my manager I will not be in this weekend. He told me he would write me up if I didn't show. I told him I'll sign it right now if he wants. He walked away.

On Monday I came in to him bitching that I wasn't there. I reminded him I told him I wouldn't be and he handed me the write up form. I pulled the crayons out of my desk and drew him a nice grass field with a tree and a happy sun in the corner. It was nice work and would of looked great on a refridgorator. He got so pissed that he didn't talk to me for the rest of the week. The next time he tried to write me up I discovered he stole my crayons and had a smug look on his face. Untill I pulled my back up crayons out.

I always kept crayons around for the fun of it. My guys would love the signs I would make for them with my crayons. That and filling out bullshit forms that management thought were important.

[–]radelix 34 points35 points  (9 children)

I hope this is true. Regardless, good story, op

[–]funktopus 38 points39 points  (8 children)

It is. I'm good to irrate managers when they pull bullshit. Once the building manger told us we needed to clock out after 8 hours then go back and finish any of our daily tasks. I held up my cell phone and asked if he wanted me to call the owner OR state labor board. When he didn't answer me I told everyone there what he was asking was illegal and if he spoke to anyone about it 1 to1 to let me know. He chose not to try and enforce that.

I've also had the labor board come into another company and interview most of the floor when we were told we needed to get in early and log into everything THEN log into the phone at our start time. Logging into the phone was like clocking in. I told my manager that if you want me there early you pay me. Then I would log into the phone first then log into our tools after that. When the labor board showed up for interviews walked out looked at the C level people standing there and started laughing. We all got checks cut for lost wages, even if you logged into the phone first. They also got fined a decent amount of money. Not sure if they lost money or what as I had already left the company by the time checks got sent out.

edit fixed a misspelling

[–]AbacusWizard 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Back-up crayons. Utterly magnificent.

[–]Holdann 74 points75 points  (39 children)

Where I work if you skip on OT it hits your attendance rating, basically eats up any sick day/personal day you have. And they will write you up and put you on the supervisors shit list making every day miserable. Also this is a union job its probably one of the worst aspects of the job.

[–]dumboy 107 points108 points  (36 children)

You should talk to your union - sick & personal days count against 40 hour weeks - so if they burn your sick day on hours you've already worked; they are "stealing" hours they are contractually obligated to pay you.

I imagine "double counting" is going to have implications for their Payroll taxes. Are they paying extra taxes on hours you didn't work just to punish you? Are they claiming you worked these hours & then not paying taxes on them? Are they lying to the IRS & DOL about your total compensation? How the fuck do they pass audits?

...And Holy MOLY are they liable if anybody ever wants to bring a "constructive dismissal" case against them.

I just don't see how this could be true if you work for a company that pays taxes & hires Union. There are too many people whoose entire carieer is to collect those taxes & get those workers their benefits.

[–]Holdann 14 points15 points  (35 children)

Here I'll just lay it out, so its a 12 hour rotating shift, we get a good deal of time off, a couple 3 day weekends and a 7 day break a month.

But OT can hit you on your time off depending on how much other shifts ask for. Around the start of summer we were very short staffed and they weren't hiring/ were trying I guess so OT was ludicrously high, basically once every 3 day break I got hit and 2 or 3 times on our 7 day break. I called out once and the next day I was scheduled to come in my supervisor came over to me and asked if I wanted to use my vacation day for it, I said no because we have a 6 month rolling average for our attendance and this was the first time I called off. I already used my personal day. All the old heads here in the union love the OT it honestly boggles my mind.

I'm not spouting anti union rhetoric or anything, its the only reason I wanna work here but damn they really burned me back when OT was the way it was and everyone has a "it is what it is" attitude about it.

Edit; We also are allowed to mark off our OT day if we don't want it, but that just lets someone who signs up for that day take your ot, it does not mean we can get out of it. If no one signs up on the day I mark off I get forced to do the ot. They even put a little red F next to my name on the schedule.

[–]dumboy 39 points40 points  (30 children)

Your off-hours work schedule has nothing to do with it.

"Personal day" & "sick day" & "work schedule" are real, legal things.

You can't claim the first two against a calendar day you weren't on the work schedule.

You can't be docked regular pay for hours you already worked, for refusing OT work or any other reason.

Taking away Personal/Sick Hours as punishment, is against the legal definition of what "sick" or "personal" day is.

Either you're confused or I am. You're being mugged. Ask for real help. Don't just vent on the internet.

[–]Holdann 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I might not be conveying it correctly, regardless I just was throwing my experience out there.

[–]Marcus_Aurelius13at work 2 points3 points  (1 child)

UNION job? Where Siberia?

[–]tritonice 50 points51 points  (34 children)

https://www.dol.gov/sites/dolgov/files/WHD/legacy/files/fs17a_overview.pdf

Most exempt employees fall under the "Professional Exemption".

In theory, an exempt employee could refuse unpaid overtime, but in most states the company would just fire you.

[–]PurpleYoshiEgg 25 points26 points  (5 children)

If I had more money and time, I'd totally fight that professional exemption. I've worked several software development jobs where I was salaried (specifically salaried and exempt), but we still bill the client hourly for any work. While the expectation was a minimum of 8 hours per day butts-in-seats, we would very readily be expected to go over for no additional compensation. The fact their profits depend on working per hour to me should make the professional exemption moot.

I can't for the life of me understand how salaried came to be considered a good thing. It basically means in IT you get paid the same, but are expected to work 50-60 hours per week (especially in crunch time).

[–]exegesisClique 6 points7 points  (1 child)

I can't even imagine it. Time and a half for crunch time? Holy shit.

[–]SippieCup 4 points5 points  (0 children)

My startup pays hourly exactly for this reason.

If you don't track hours, you get 36 hours minimum per week. If you track and go over, you get time and a half.

Unlimited vacation and overtime. If you are being overworked, you are compensated, and the company knows to hire more people.

Performance reviews are based on net value added to the company. If you are producing more than you cost, it's a net benefit. If you are logging a bunch of overtime and underproducing, you get cut.

It keeps both sides pretty honest. Management needs to give realistic time lines and costs. If they don't and there's a lot of crunch, their budget gets fucked. So they are more likely to get devs working effectively earlier, rather than band aids at the end.

[–]ErgoMachina 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Because salaried work is better if you have some basic labor laws in place. A normal salaried contract is about 40-45 hours per week and overtime payed by the hour.

What happens in the US is a travesty which happens when you don't have regulations and a completely passive workforce. Seriously, if I didn't knew about history I would say the Americans just don't know how to riot. Could you imagine what would happen in France?

[–]Shesalabmix 16 points17 points  (24 children)

What a bag of dicks. Past time to fight back. Give me some of those worker rights that the French have.

[–]buckykat 35 points36 points  (0 children)

Worker rights are taken, not given

[–]MiKeMcDnetcorrumpere ducibus 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Most salaried IT Workers are in this horrible pool.

[–]chaotic----neutral 25 points26 points  (5 children)

The top 1% of the population own 43% of the total wealth in the United States, and the bottom 80% own 7%.

All America did was make slavery less costly for the rich by instituting "free-range wage slaves" that pay for their own housing and care. Thus, having slaves became a fixed cost for the owning class, and they have doggedly pursued reducing those costs while also increasing productivity.

[–]EliSka93 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Because billionaires wanted to exist and labor / wage theft is the easiest way there.

[–]ryathal 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Mandatory overtime is also a way to make pay look better than it really is.

[–]davidmsterns 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Because rich people are able to buy off politicians. And it's not even expensive. You can buy off half of the house and senate for like 20M. It's insane how easy these people are to bribe.

[–]Fredselfish 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Well Supreme Court about to make striking illegal. So we won't have that power long.

[–]anyfox7Anarchist 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Some words of Malatesta to consider:

"Governments make the law. They must therefore dispose of the material forces (police and army) to impose the law, for otherwise only those who wanted to would obey it, and it would no longer be the law, but a simple series of suggestions which all would be free to accept or reject. Governments have this power, however, and use it through the law, to strengthen their power, as well as to serve the interests of the ruling classes, by oppressing and exploiting the workers.

The only limit to the oppression of government is the power with which the people show themselves capable of opposing it.

...the government does not pay attention to discontent and popular resistance except when it is faced with the danger of insurrection.

When the people meekly submit to the law, or their protests are feeble and confined to words, the government studies its own interests and ignores the needs of the people; when the protests are lively, insistent, threatening, the government, depending on whether it is more or less understanding, gives way or resorts to repression. But one always comes back to insurrection, for if the government does not give way, the people will end by rebelling." - An Anarchist Programme

Just think of the 2020 uprisings were instead a collective rebellion against economic oppression...

[–]Fun-Introduction-356Power to the Proletariat! 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I was in a union, a really big union, and we had mandatory overtime. They called it being designated. They could designate us any time for that weekend up to our first break on the last day of the work week. So if you had plans to go out Saturday or Sunday, those could be ruined Friday afternoon and there's nothing you can do about it. They weren't allowed to designated us for more than 2 weekends in a row though, so we would get a weekend off after 19 days, and then go right back into mandatory 12s and weekends....but we made $40/hr plus double time but even after making a million dollars I can say for a fact it isn't worth it at all.

Edit: For comparison, non union jobs in the exact same field would pay 15-20/hr and you'd only get time and a half, and far less benefits. So even though my union sold out and bent over for big business I was far better off in this corrupt union than without a union. You're almost always better off being in a union, even if it sucks.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Cuz 'murica haz freedumbs!

Wait till you find out it's unpaid because they're salaried.

[–]IsThatBlueSoup 4 points5 points  (0 children)

In every interview, even before the pandemic, I always ask about overtime. If they say it's required, I thank them for their time and leave the interview. I have never worked mandatory overtime in my life and I never will. The only time I'll stay late is if I failed to get my work done for the day and that has never happened.

[–]zimreapers 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Salary employees are exempt from overtime per federal labor laws.

[–]dsjunior1388 1 point2 points  (0 children)

People with capital bribed people with power and the people with power made it legal

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

The only 7 day a week jobs I worked were union.

[–]Negligent__discharge 11 points12 points  (0 children)

The most effective Union tool is money. My day six starts at double time. If my bosses want to start forcing for a day seven, the Union would fight back by asking for it to start at triple time.

It doesn't stop crazy asks, but at least you get paid.

Unions also need criticle mass. Seven people in one store can't change anything. Seven thousand from all stores can.

[–]Bratmon 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Tech employees are considered "exempt," which means labor laws don't apply to them.

[–]dsdvbguutres 428 points429 points  (8 children)

This is why billionaires spend good money to sling anti union agenda

[–]raven00x 132 points133 points  (7 children)

As always, food for thought: If unions are so terrible, why do billionaires and corporations spend so goddamn much time and money trying to squash them?

Join a union, form a union if your field doesn't already have them. Make life better for you and for all of the other workers.

[–]TraditionalSky5617 19 points20 points  (1 child)

Unionization is inevitable in manufacturing and after the founder of the company passes.

Billionaires and corporations spend so much time killing them because of pensions (guaranteed money) takes money out of control of Wall Street and 401(k).

Also, unions introduce a middle level of management which the company can’t control.

If you watch the CNN Miniseries “Murdoch: Empire of Influence”, one of the first thing Rupert Murdoch did was keep newspaper prices the same, while firing the unions in England. He pocketed the extra cash.

Then, Rupert used that extra cash to lobby Ronald Regan after he became President to allow 1. foreign nationals to own TV stations, 2. Allow a media company to operate both a newspaper and TV station in the same market.

Unions ensure a livable wage, but if you break the union, you don’t need to pay at a Union rate.

[–]Bullen-Noxen 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I’ve said this before & I’ll say it till the day I die. Reagan was a mistake. That guy should never had held power. Then they tried that shit again with donald in order to make the final strike. I do not think we will live the next attempt unless all those scum bags who think & act & advocate, & support, such thinking & philosophy, are gone from society, entirely. I expect the next attempt at such an aggressive grab of power to happen around 35 to 40 years later from the last attempt. So either 2050 or 2060, these kinds of monsters will go for “the win” once again. Which is scary as fuck.

[–]xander-atl 2 points3 points  (0 children)

because billionaires are rich so that means they are good. i trust elon more than i trust people who might actually have my best interests in mind 🥾👅

[–]ranktankler 443 points444 points  (13 children)

That's how you become the world's richest man. Mandate the labor of others in efforts to line your own pockets and add to already disgusting level of wealth.

[–]Michamus 39 points40 points  (0 children)

Every billionaire is a monument to wage theft.

[–]Chadmartigan 30 points31 points  (11 children)

Mandate the labor of others in efforts to line your own pockets and add to already disgusting level of wealth.

Seems like we'd have a word for that by now...

[–]xtrpns 8 points9 points  (10 children)

Shhhhhh! You can't say that in America!

[–]CVanScythe 9 points10 points  (9 children)

What, capitalism or slavery? Cause they kinda base their entire society around both.

[–]Chrona_trigger 7 points8 points  (8 children)

Just a reminder that slavery is still legal in the US! Read the text of the 13th amendment, and not the 'except' in there

[–]Tarvoz 4 points5 points  (6 children)

If they find a way to make striking a felony they can just make everyone a slave lol

[–]Chrona_trigger 4 points5 points  (3 children)

I mean, they're criminalizing being homeless in a lot of places...

[–]CVanScythe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why bother when they can just murder dissenters who refuse to be their slaves?

[–]CVanScythe 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The real reason for the "war on drugs" and "just say no" movements of the Reagan, Nixon and Bush (Sr.) administrations.

I've got oodles of data about stuff like this, but when I put it on display it makes me look crazy (cause this shit's crazy).

[–][deleted] 106 points107 points  (8 children)

Everyone forgets these people can still strike. The first strikes weren’t done by unions, just pissed off workers. Everyone just should sit down at their desk and refuse to work and refuse to leave. Make Musk bring in a goon squad to remove them and make sure the news cameras are there to capture the carnage. Make it the worst day of his life.

[–]AngelaTheRipper 66 points67 points  (7 children)

Striking in tech would be pretty easy tbh. Just turn off the servers or deploy something broken to production. Then just sit back and watch the fireworks.

[–]Turtle_Shell_Sheild 23 points24 points  (0 children)

This right here. They strike now or watch their work be used as a weapon against democracy and common decency.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (5 children)

That would be sabotage, not striking.

...why not a little of both?

[–]CommercialBox4175 138 points139 points  (21 children)

How did the UAW not ever unionize tesla

[–]ryathal 89 points90 points  (15 children)

As a car company Tesla is a rounding error. Also UAW isn't exactly a popular union

[–]chalbersma 115 points116 points  (13 children)

Also UAW isn't exactly a popular union

This is the real reason. Everyone saw UAW let GM and Ford screw it's workers in 2008 and collectively went, "why the fuck even have a union."

[–]ryathal 30 points31 points  (0 children)

Unions got a decent deal in the GM bankruptcy. They really failed with some smaller suppliers though and played hardball when they shouldn't have like with Delphi though.

[–]ArtisanSamosa 19 points20 points  (7 children)

I know 08 was bad, but before that I remember gm factory workers making 25 to 30 an hour. I can't imagine them doing that without the unions help.

[–]dsjunior1388 21 points22 points  (0 children)

People with money tell the 2008 story more than the 25-30 an hour story.

People without money get used to the 2008 story and forget about the other story.

It's a shame that unionized journalists are often unable to tell the truth about other unionized individuals due to corpriatized news media.

[–]Threedawg 7 points8 points  (4 children)

They make much more than that now..

The UAW is incredibly effective, but they only have leverage over companies where they already have a hold on their factories.

[–]thegroovemonkey 1 point2 points  (0 children)

A documentary about the Janesville, WI plant goes into it and was a pretty interesting watch when it came out.

[–]orangejake 8 points9 points  (0 children)

UAW has also been going through some corruption scandels in recent years. My local is great, but national definitely has some issues.

[–]blakef223 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Everyone saw UAW let GM and Ford screw it's workers in 2008 and collectively went, "why the fuck even have a union."

It's been a minute but IIRC there were quite a few confounding factors in those negotiations especially with GM and Chrysler going through their bankruptcies at the time with mass layoffs on the table, the possibility of any future development being sent overseas, and the possibility of a complete implosion and scuttling of the industry.

I'd blame them more for contract negotiations after the fact in ~2014ish where they didn't get those concessions back.

[–]AtomicMalarkey 8 points9 points  (0 children)

There was a big push at the Fremont, Ca factory. Musk showed up in person to bust it though. He and the company was found to have broken labor laws by doing this, but he successfully broke it up and the only consequence was a slap on the wrist and an order to post a notice saying he shouldn't have done that.

[–]Lobo2ffs 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Took me a few seconds to not read it as United Arab Wemirates

[–]tenDayThrowaway69876 217 points218 points  (26 children)

How the fuck do you do this off the grid with thousands in unison, though? Unions at big tech would grant the most leverage but be the hardest to instill.

edit: scientists and engineers need a defined and sizeable role in government with checks and balances

[–]Cat_Marshal 71 points72 points  (20 children)

A Union would be interesting in my white color collar engineering setting. It hasn’t ever felt super necessary yet.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children)

I am an electrical engineer in a union. Its pretty dope. We are only union because we work closely with electricians such as linemen and other utility workers. But we bargain with them and it helps us quite a bit.

[–]overzeetop 4 points5 points  (1 child)

It used to be illegal - or, at least, ethically disqualifying and the board could revoke your license/status - for professional engineers to unionize. I'm fairly certain that is no longer the case. background reading

[–]Cat_Marshal 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Experience has demonstrated, beyond any reasonable doubt, that an engineer with a union-minded attitude cannot and does not regard his relations with his employer as that of a faithful agent or trustee. And it is likewise clear that such an attitude entails misunderstanding of the engineering profession by the public and is in conflict with the engineer's duty to maintain the highest standards of the> profession and regard the public welfare as paramount to his own.

So much gaslighting

[–]JustEnoughDucks 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My engineering company took away some benefits this year and seems to be poised to take away our company car benefits (big thing in Belgium because of tax reasons) because they want more profit and are riding hard on the sunk cost fallacy as they buy their cars and don't lease like every other sizable company.

[–]gooberstwo 23 points24 points  (3 children)

The same way Hollywood unions work. The employees are all in the same gang, regardless of employer.

[–]hysys_whisperer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ask the wobblies

[–]beermaker 35 points36 points  (2 children)

As an ex Teamster, Union dues are a pittance compared to the better wages, benefits, and representation a proper Union will bring.

Our company constantly sent us building material delivery drivers & crane operators out in the morning overweight... the more jobs they could stack on us before returning to the yard, the better. The overall weight of the material is printed right on the delivery tickets.

One call to our union steward & he'd immediately shut down the 7 other trucks at our location & threaten to shut down another 10 nearby until our loads were reconfigured. If any of us had gotten a ticket from the DOT for running overweight, we'd be responsible, not our employer, for the fines and legal repercussions & the Union squashed it like a bug every time we caught it.

We all do better when we all do better.

[–]Nephalos 7 points8 points  (1 child)

My Union dues are like 1% of my paycheck. Most unions charge 1-2% of your paycheck as dues. They’re cheap and companies make it sound like you won’t be able to afford a roof over your head if you buy into the communist propaganda or w.e they call it.

There is very little reason not to be in a Union.

[–]The_Original_Miser 67 points68 points  (4 children)

Dare I say unionize Twitter also?

[–]seagulpinyo 58 points59 points  (3 children)

Twitter is perfectly positioned to unionize and radically transform the company despite their shitty new ceo.

Every day I pray the Twitter employees rally, not just for themselves, but for workers in all fields even beyond tech.

Corporations are the products of the labor of the many and shouldn’t be operated solely at the whims of one corrupt man.

[–]Diamondhands_Rex 6 points7 points  (0 children)

If corporations are people because of citizens United then they should be able to unionize if the person decides to with little issue ideally

[–]JustKinda 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I hate violence. I do not condone violence. Violence is inherently unfair. Okay. That's out of the way. Seriously, if a billionaire fires you, you lose your house, possibly your family, at what point does the cost/benefit analysis just result in you killing the guy? If someone looks around and has no life left, they are going to look for someone to blame. The guy throwing cars into outer space is an easy one to decide on. And it only takes one. These billionaires are approaching this with a cavalier attitude and it is going to result in them with the most toys, but being dead with the most toys.

[–]mybreakfastiscold 27 points28 points  (0 children)

Another reason why billionaires hate unions. Because when they go to sell the company, nobody wants to buy it if it has a union 😂 "Oh no, too much trouble"

"Unions are bad because they devalue the company!" Tough shit bruh. Thats only a problem because of the sociopathic juggernaut we call capitalism

[–]RickyOzzy[S] 35 points36 points  (0 children)

[–]secretid89 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Software engineer here! Unfortunately, a lot of engineers have been brainwashed into thinking that we don’t need unions, or that unions are bad.

Somehow, we have to overcome that!

For starters, good pay doesn’t make up for crappy working conditions! We’re not objects for sale- we’re people!

Different color collar, same leash.

[–]iMissTheOldInternet 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The anti-union propaganda in this country is insane. Software engineers should 100% be unionized. So much of our labor market is a kludge built on top of a kludge built roughly around a management/labor dynamic that exists in a small minority of (mostly heavy industrial) companies.

At your average tech business, there are no "blue collar workers", other than like the custodial staff, yet there is still the same pyramid of laborers who create value, management who discipline labor and owners who skim value off the top. The fact that the laborers are salaried and get to sit at desks all day doesn't change the fundamental class dynamics.

[–]LocalInactivist 6 points7 points  (2 children)

The irony is that if the company gives people positive incentive they’ll do it anyway. If the rank and file employees have profit sharing and/or stock options then they have a stake in the success of the company and they’ll work harder. A 1% bonus at the end of the year IF the company makes its profit goals is not incentive. It’s 2 1/2 days pay, maybe a few hundred dollars. If the company makes billions and execs are getting bonuses large enough to buy vacation homes, getting 20 hours of bonus pay in exchange for 400 hours of unpaid overtime is an insult.

One year my holiday bonus was a coupon for 1/2 a gallon of Safeway brand ice cream. I was not happy.

[–]jab136 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Unionize everything, even the companies that have reputations for being pretty good places to work. A rising tide lifts all ships.

[–]the_space_mans 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I worked at Tesla and said this same thing constantly. every time, I was quietly taken into a meeting and told to stop disturbing the general offtopic chat. messages pertaining to unions would be deleted in front of us, even as we all saw it happen in real time

it's probably good I left when I did because I reckon I was inches from getting fired

[–]VexedClown 19 points20 points  (2 children)

You don’t need a union to beat the shit outta some one. If you get within arms reach of a billionaire start swinging.

[–]MirrorMan22102018 11 points12 points  (1 child)

Funny enough, in the old days, they did that; beat their boss in front of their family. Or threatened them at gunpoint.

[–]VexedClown 14 points15 points  (0 children)

It’s that or unions. They chose to be anti union therefore they most be pro getting beaten to death lol.

[–]Aktor 3 points4 points  (0 children)

General strike May 2023

[–]testedonsheep 3 points4 points  (0 children)

lol Twitter better start unionizing soon.

[–]DiploJ 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Fix the following issues and see a better America:

  1. Citizens United

  2. Trickle-down economics

  3. Restore the Fairness Doctrine

  4. Term limit

[–]AgonizingFury 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm curious, how many people wanting to "unionize Tesla" even personally know someone who works there? One of my good friends works there, he's a manufacturing worker. Makes a really good wage for his area, health benefits are all paid for (health, dental, vision) at $0 cost to him, including coverage for his entire family, he gets great bonuses (in Tesla stock that vests slowly, but they are generous). The only thing he said needs improvement. There, is paid vacation time for hourly people.

I've asked him several times when I've seen posts like this in the past, he says neither he, nor anyone he works with has any interest in a union.

[–]joremero 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I honestly think everyone still at TSLA has drank the Elon-koolaid

[–]Zirowe 11 points12 points  (13 children)

Funny how I can do the same without an union, since my working hours are stated in my contract and nothing more can be demanded from me without an equal compensation.

But you know, I'm not in the US.

[–]KioLaFek 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Even in your probation period?

[–]idog99 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Just think of what else you might have if you had the power of collective bargaining on your side.

Never be satisfied with "just good enough"

[–]TheBasketBass 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Twitter! You guys need to unionize now!

[–]stodolak 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Tesla workers should strike and form a union. If I worked there, I'd support it. Maybe.

It's a difficult situation but I kinda hope Twitter fails with Elon at the helm. He needs a dose of reality. Who the hell does he think he is!?

[–]PetitionNameLimit 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Basically, if the company you work for is owned by Elon musk, unionize ASAP. But there are plenty of other rich criminals that should also deal with unions

[–]chocomint-nice 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Make full-course French Revolutions cool again. We’re clearly overdue one.

[–]Bigleftbowski 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Tesla's factory in California isn't climate controlled. People working on the assembly line complained of working in 100 degree conditions.

[–]Typical-End3060 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You'd be surprised how many people have been brainwashed into thinking unions are bad within Tesla. Work with an old dude who hates unions cause he had one bad experience but was way better off based on our conversations about it. He grew up in a family that owned emerald mines in Apartheid South Africa, what do people expect?

[–]TalkingBackAgain 2 points3 points  (0 children)

12 hour days in a 7 days a week schedule.

What is the rational expectation of what all that work would achieve?

The combined Twitter workforce should walk instantly.

This happens when workers allow it. It’s that simple. ‘Power’ is the acceptance of the people that someone has power over them. When the people say ‘no’, that’s when it stops.

As ever, and I’ll keep saying it: if you are one voice they’ll chop your block off. If -everybody- does it then it can’t be ignored.

The US needs a general strike to reset the balance.

Or the capitalists need to be reminded what happens when the right to protest no longer applies.

[–]koolkeith987 5 points6 points  (3 children)

Just don’t buy Tesla’s, shut it down. They are fucking garage cars that people with way more money then sense have something to pretend to feel good about.

[–]cryp7 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed, buy an EV from VW or Toyota .

[–]AureliusJudgesYou 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Sorry to be that guy, but to think such a thing one must live in a La La Land bubble.

Laws don't apply to humans with power.

Look around you.

EVERYONE of them is corrupt, and PMs and Presidents (that are on their payrolls and sponsorships) honor them.

That said, yes, we need Unions and when it comes to low-mid tier businesses, they are priceless.

Union up people ✊🏼

[–]InadequateUsername 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Doug Ford: What's that? You want to strike? That's illegal.

[–]KittenKoderViews 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Unions for all!

[–]godlyvex 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This gives me a great idea for a game. I'm thinking it could be an asymmetrical cooperative game, where 1 player is the boss/manager, who has the goal of making the most money (or some other goal which incentivizes depriving the other players of resources while still somewhat coinciding with their goal) and the other players work under the boss/manager and have to do the actual hard work of fighting enemies, with some limited ways to fight back against the manager who hoards the money you need to buy equipment. I feel like there's a lot of interesting mechanics you could get out of a game like that.

[–]nomadProgrammer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

hell yes unions ftw

[–]stonewall386 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We need to unionize pretty much everything

[–]cromaticman 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I got in trouble for using the word union in teams. My employer hates the idea of a union. One of the biggest companies in the world lol

[–]charliefoxtrot9 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Too bad they're in fucking China. Fuck Elon Musk!

[–]joik 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Boycott twatter

[–]Its_Beelzebozo_Time 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well Tesla too but I think this particular post is in reference to Musk making Twitter employees work 84 hours this week to meet some BS deadline he set for this coming Monday.

[–]CLS4L 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sleepy Joe approves

[–]P_O_P_P_O 1 point2 points  (0 children)

why do it legally

[–]Suzume_Chikahisa 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And SpaceX, and Boring, and Twitter.

[–]Tancread-of-Galilee 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Musk would literally just fire them all for that. He pays his workers like triple the average value at Tesla, they are not hard to find replacements for.

[–]GeorgioAllanVincent 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Unionize? Burn that place down. Musk is insane and needs to be stopped. Too much money for a mad man. Real life super villain here.

[–]awill2020 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Elon fired anyone who tried to form a union.

[–]LateStageAdult 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Here's the deal.

Capitalists only have an illusion of power.

You, the worker, are the only reason they are able to be rich.

They take the value that you add to a good or product, and only give you a fraction of that.

The trick is, if you refuse to work, they don't get anything.

You have all the power.

[–]Hiranonymous 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Musk isn't the only one doing this, which is why white collar workers need unions too. Enough of companies pushing people into 80+ hour work weeks for no additional compennsation and threats of firing.

[–]Centralredditfan -5 points-4 points  (36 children)

While I'm not a fan of American style corrupt Unions, we should definitely implement European style Worker protections, where 12 hour days on weekends just aren't allowed by law.

[–]SleepyOtter 53 points54 points  (1 child)

Imagine making a blanket statement like American "style" unions are corrupt. Absolute pro-coroporate propaganda take.

[–]IsThatBlueSoup 16 points17 points  (0 children)

You can tell which people read the posters in the bathroom that were put up by HR. 🤣

[–]brutalweasel 14 points15 points  (6 children)

If you don’t want a corrupt union, organize in a solidarity union like the IWW. It’s Democratic, no reps between you and the bosses, just the workers and the direct action they’re willing to do. Government will never do what we want unless we put the screws on it; the whole reason the new deal passed was because militant labor was threatening to upend the whole system. It wasn’t just a popular voting movement. The labor movement was international, and was even stronger and more sustained in parts of Western Europe. They’ve gotten complacent and they’re losing some rights to big capital there too.

Until labor is willing to organize and agitate for their rights again, there won’t be change. Until we’re ready to completely overhaul the system, any gains will be short lived.

[–]IsThatBlueSoup 8 points9 points  (4 children)

And yet we have shills here who have taken the corporate stance of "unions bad". That's why workers will never have any power in this country. Because these idiots would rather disparage unions because one guy they don't like might benefit from it, rather than using it as a collective bargaining chip.

[–]BlackwinIVAnarcho-Communist 42 points43 points  (9 children)

europs laws exist because of our unions.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

anarcho communist fetishizing reformist laws lmfao

[–]MallenautAnarcho-Communist 6 points7 points  (1 child)

we should definitely implement European style Worker protections

I wonder who fought for these European worker protections....

[–]Vukov_Intrigued 6 points7 points  (4 children)

I guess I don't live in Europe, then?

[–]Centralredditfan 2 points3 points  (3 children)

There is no reason that EU style Worker protections can't be exported globally, other than the lack of will of politicians in other countries. (The lack of will is enforced by lobbying)

[–]Vukov_Intrigued 9 points10 points  (2 children)

The lack of will is enforced by union apathy and the labor market. Politicians push worker protections when they are forced directly by unions or to prevent possible strikes by buying social peace. No matter the slogans and colors politicians will never work for us.

Most EU unions are yellow corrupt pieces of shit in bed with the politicians, sadly. Still better than no unions.

[–]tenDayThrowaway69876 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Sane government intervention makes the most sense I think. I don't know if we have it here.

[–]Kreeper125 21 points22 points  (6 children)

The only corrupt unions are the police unions (mostly, there are of course exceptions). Which is the worst possible fucking one to be corrupt

[–]Shesalabmix 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Worked for UPS and while the Teamsters do lots of good, they are corrupt as fuck.

[–]tenDayThrowaway69876 4 points5 points  (0 children)

All networks are susceptible to corruption, be they garbage men or LAPD.

At the end of the day, corporations in and of themselves aren't the core issue. They're simply groups with too much relative power in the hands of too few. This system can exist under any outer construct (thought corps likely lean stronger towards corruption).

[–]Centralredditfan 2 points3 points  (3 children)

UAW comes to mind. Literally the reason why none of my friends working at Tesla want to join it. They like Unions, they just don't want the UAW. There was even talk about starting a new union for tech workers in electric car companies.

[–]MSTmatt 3 points4 points  (2 children)

That's so crazy to me they don't want to join the UAW.

I'm in Detroit at a Big 3 auto company, and being in the UAW seems like an absolute gravy train, compared to other labor unions.

Not joining the UAW is just listening to the propaganda.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

all unions that cooperate with capital will inevitably become corrupt with time

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Meh. More jumping on the "let's hate Elon Musk" bandwagon for clout Looked her up and this is like the most engagement she's ever had. LOL

Really hard to feel bad for people working in Silicon Valley who get to work in some of the nicest facilities with salaries and benefits many others can only dream of and can probably get away with working whenever they feel like it.

So he fired the C-suite. So what? I thought this sub hated useless, greedy executives who command high salaries doing who knows what.

[–]0bservation 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I work for Tesla now. And for the 15 years that I worked before Tesla, it was for a career under the United Auto Workers Union. In 5 years at Tesla, I was able to get more training/experience, career opportunities, benefits, and a better work/life balance than I EVER got at my previous job. Feel how you want about Elon - but fuck unions. IMO, union leaders are more corrupt than my CEO.

[–]Sir_John_Barleycorn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m in a large union in California and I’m still forced to work 80-100 hours a week. It all comes down to the law and trust me, the law is very generous to employers.

[–]Kengriffinspimp 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wouldn’t work there even with a union. Elon is a pedo

[–]OldSell3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I miss the old Unions that would break into a plant managers mansion and [REDACTED] him in front of his family to get the point across.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (13 children)

Yea, you really don't need a union for this, unless you like handing over part of your paycheck to be part of a protection racket.

[–]Rudak1701 1 point2 points  (12 children)

Yeah you really do or your boss can just fire you in "right to work" states.

[–]orvillegene52 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I know people that worked for companies that have unions and they quit cause they lost vacation time their benefits went thru the roof they started working longer hours took away breaks and union didn't help them it made it worse

[–]BoardGameObsession 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This deadline is over in early November, so people at Twitter may have to put in about one week of massive hours. It's a test. It will also show the company who is willing to work hard and make things happen and who isn't.

[–]Sikaslicing87 0 points1 point  (0 children)

12 hour shifts are mandatory by law anything over that is illegal know your workers laws people