CICO diet

I am not sure why this is so controversial.

Calories are a unit of energy.

Body fat is a form of energy storage.

If you consume more calories than you burn, body fat will increase.

If you consume fewer calories than you burn, body fat will decrease.

The effects are not always immediate and variables like water weight can sometimes delay the appearance of results.

Also, weight alone does not always indicate how healthy a person is.

But, at the end of the day, all biological systems, no matter how complex, are based on chemistry and physics.

If your body is in a calorie surplus, you will eventually gain weight.

If your body is in a calorie deficit, you will eventually lose weight.

I posted this a couple months ago and I thought it may be helpful to repost for the new year.

CICO means Calories in, Calories out. CICO is not a diet and is not new, it is a descriptor for how your body gets, uses and stores energy. Calories In is any food or drink you have though out the day. Calories Out is the energy your body uses for basic functions to keep you alive, like breathing and keeping your heart beating PLUS any exercise you do on top of your basic metabolic functions. The majority of your Calories Out is used for basic metabolic functions or just being alive. For the average person, exercise calories is only a very small portion of your Calories Out. This is why weight loss starts in the kitchen. If your CI is greater than your CO you have excess energy. .

See the to estimate your Calories Out based on your height, weight, age and activity level.

If you want to lose weight you have to consume less calories than you burn during a day so your body uses your fat stores, also called a calorie deficit.

A diet is a way of managing your food intake to keep your calories in less than your calories out. Some ways work great for some people and not so great for others. It is up to you as an individual to figure out what technique or combination of techniques you can sustainably manage. Remember crash diets are not sustainable which is why they do not work, this is for the long haul and it really works.

Here is some of the more popular diets around here that people use to manage calorie intake:

- low carb, very popular, works great for breaking sugar habits and for people who always feel hungry. Low carb, high fat and protein keep you feeling fuller for longer and allow you to eat less and feel more satisfied. Can be problematic for people who have a savory tooth and tend to over eat on more savory foods or for people who don’t want to cut a bunch of things out of their diet.

Also see and if you need vegan or veggie options

/ - low carb like keto, but not as strict carb-wise, focuses on whole food and no processed foods. The theory behind this is to eat like our paleolithic ancestors who did not eat things like bread or cookies. Really good if you want to get in to eating more whole food and less processed foods or if you feel hungry all the time. Same issues as keto, if you over eat savory food or don’t want to cut any foods out, you may have a problem here.

- works well for people who don't want to track calories or don't want to cut out certain foods. Instead you track serving sizes and make sure to have a balanced amount of carb, fats and proteins in each meal. Can be problematic for people who don't know what a correct portion size is or have trouble estimating what a correct portion size looks like.

Also see for different type of portion control.

- The most popular around here. Also what most people mistakenly refer to as the "CICO diet". Enter every scrap of food you ingest in to a tracker like MyFitnessPal or LoseIt. Works well for people who want exact numbers, don’t want to cut any foods or who don't know what correct portions sizes look like. You can't go wrong if you know exactly how much you are putting in your body. Can be practiced in tandem with any other diet. Can be problematic for people who get too obsessed with numbers.

Also see for vegan or veggie options.

- works great for late night eaters, people who want to break snacking habits or volume eaters. Save all your calories for a short time period and fast the rest of the time. Can be problematic for people who prefer to snack or for people who want to eat many small meals throughout the day. This can also be an issue if you have binge tendencies and may binge enough during your eating window to blow out your caloric deficit for the day.

a type of IF, OMAD is good for volume eaters. Save all your daily calories for one big meal and eat your heart out once a day. Same problems as IF, if you like being a grazer, or have binge issues or can't eat in volume this may not work for you.

This is like advanced calorie counting. Consume only what fits within your allotted macros. Mostly practiced by people who are training. Good if you want to track the specific macronutrients you are consuming or you have macro goals given to you by a dietitian or trainer. This technique requires you have a basic knowledge of macros and nutrition, if you are a beginner you may find it difficult to set up a macro program that works for weight loss without the help of a specialist.

You don't have to do just one of these, many people do a combinations of techiques, like Calorie Counting + Keto, or IF + Portion Control. Remember no matter what process you choose to manage your calorie intake, . What these options allow for is different ways of sticking to your calorie deficit and helping to manage your personal cravings.

Bottom line is CICO can be managed in many forms and you need to find out what way works best for you.

What this subreddit has never recommended and never will is to eat your daily calories only in candy or junk food. It is not a coincidence that food that is good for you also keeps you feeling full for longer and is easier to incorporate in to a life long sustainable lifestyle.

CICO shows you HOW food works, it doesn't tell you what to eat or when to eat it. That decision is up to you.

Today marks my 365 day anniversary on myfitnesspal. I have lost 213.4lbs

Before and after pics below

The top three are pictures before I lost weight, but not even my heaviest because I was too embarrassed to be seen in a picture. The bottom left was a few months ago, around thanksgiving. The bottom right is a week ago.

When I started my weight was 602lbs, and I was miserable. I couldn't walk far without my back being in severe pain. My knees were killing me constantly and I had hurt my heel. I was taking over 2,000mg of ibuprofen to kill pain in my heel. I was basically waiting to die at this point.

I then found this community and people using myfitnesspal, they were doing nothing but tracking calories and losing weight, I figured shit. I can do that. I showed my wife posts on here and how people were successful without going to a gym. I then watched videos on meal prepping because when we come home from work we were both not motivated to cook.

So the first weekend we spent like 6 hours cooking food but that whole week we had dinner, lunches and breakfasts done. I also found my old Fitbit and started wearing it again. It was awesome that week. Meals were done and ready to eat as soon as we got home.

After a month I would have murdered someone for a Big Mac or a pop. There were days I broke down and cried, yes cried because I couldn't eat fast food. I didn't realize how much food had taken over my life. At work, we have a vending machine on my floor. There were mornings I just stared at Hershey bars because I wanted one soooo fucking bad!

Eventually it got better, I started to realize that for the calories in that bad food, I could have so much more....then I found dannon light and fit Greek yogurt...that shit is my weakness. 80 calories for a container....score! Then I realized I can cook out on the grill for the entire week and I found boneless skinless chicken thighs...I eat them everyday now. I cook about 6lbs a week on the grill and eat them for lunch and use them for dinner some nights.

About 5 months in I lost 100lbs and bought myself a weight set, I got bowflex select tech weights. I love those. I started doing things I couldn't do before, for my birthday I went golfing again! I miss being able to do that. I was able to walk without my back being in so much pain.

Cue to February and my wife's birthday. That morning I woke up and broke over 200lbs lost...my wife was more excited than I was. She said me losing this weight has been the best gift I could ever give. I'm able to walk without needing to stop, I can help out around the house and not leave it to her. I also decided to do something I never thought I would do, I bought a BICYCLE!!

I haven't rode one since I was 14 and can't wait to start riding it when it's warmer out. Also, I wanted to give my wife something for putting up with me and how much she put up with when I was too heavy to do anything. I booked a trip to New Orleans! It has something we always talked about doing but never could because I couldn't walk.

Losing this much weight has saved my marriage too, my wife had to do everything for me. I couldnt help around the house so it became her job. I knew it weighed on her so much because I became a burden to her. Now, I'm planning to go on a trip together. Go on a hike together to see nature...she has said that it's like she married a new person. When we dated I weighed less than this but still never wanted to go hiking or biking anywhere.

Thank you to everyone who posted their struggles or who posted their success. It has helped me make it through my journey so far. I realize I have a lot more to lose but I already feel like a new person. You all have helped me change my life and I owe it all to everyone here...thank you!

EDIT: Thank you to whomever gave me gold. I hope my post helps inspire you to either start your journey or continue moving forward with your own.

Also, since I am on a desktop now and not rushing this post to make it before I got too involved with the walking dead here are some measurements.

Waist: Lost 14 inches in my waist.

Height: I gained an inch...I assume this is because all my weight was causing me to become bowlegged and now I can stand straight up

Shirt size: Down three sizes from an 8X to a 5X

EDIT 02:

Here are some newer pics that show more of my body than just my face.

Seems like most people here believe CICO is the sole factor in weight loss. I'm not knocking the idea, but if that's true, then what's the purpose of staying in ketosis all the time? What would be the potential harm in popping in and out of ketosis at random so long as you maintain a calorie deficit?

EDIT: Please guys, before you downvote, understand that I'm not trying to disprove or challenge Keto. I'm genuinely just trying to understand how it works. I get that being in ketosis "causes your body to burn fat for energy instead of glucose," but what does that mean practically speaking? Is there no difference between eating 1500 cals on a regular diet versus 1500 cals on keto except that I'd be less hungry on keto? Or is there an actual increase in weight loss on keto?

Edit: Thanks for all the really interesting responses to the post. Here below is what steps I've taken to try to be more healthy alongside my CICO food life.

1. Lifetime improvement in my weight which started with and continuing indefinitely with CICO as a sort of fundamental principle to keep to a healthy weight.

2. I've cut out all processed meat as it's scientifically stated as to cause cancer.

3. I've cut down on red meat although I'm not vegetarian

4. I've tried to cut down on any type of processed food where possible but it's more about "what I eat" so keeping away from anything with "trans fats".

5. Increased my vegetarian food.

6. Cut out alcohol

7. Don't smoke

8. The last one I need to do is to start a regular regime of exercise and which I've not done yet.

Please can you add on any little ideas or suggestions that are considered to be fundamentally more healthful or what to cut out.

What are your overall thoughts about sugar? I remember there was a guy called Professor Robert Lustig who was an advocate for cutting down on all types of sugar that was in processed foods but his fundamental science has been brought into question.

I have failed at so many diets. I have done Atkins, Keto, a little this and that, but I never reached my goal weight, nor was I successful in keeping it off. And honestly, I couldn’t stick with it because it was about depriving myself to reach some goal, not about fixing my fucked up way of eating.

While they did take off some weight, I knew it wasn’t sustainable. I always wanted to lose it fast so the pain would be over quickly.

This time, I spoke with my doctor at length, he was quite helpful. Just admitting it was a huge first step. I had a friend that went from prediabetic to ideal weight by CICO and kept it off five years. It wasn’t sexy or exciting, it wasn’t dramatic.

I started really examining my relationship with food. I had to admit I had no idea how little my body needed, what qualified as a reasonable amount, or even what I should be eating. Years of diet confusion had taken their toll. I used to know these things intuitively before I packed on over 100+ lbs.

I didn’t even realize that I didn’t know. I think this is the problem for most overweight people. We are all victims if a society which has normalized eating dysfunction.

I had no idea how many calories I was consuming, or that I was drinking a fair share of alcohol. I confused being hungry with the desire to mindlessly eat. Like if I wanted a second slice if pizza, I must need a second slice, I was “hungry.”

Years and years ago, I was a runner, 5’8” and weighed 125 lbs. I had never restricted my food intake or denied myself anything.

I really thought about how I ate back then. I would consume about 1500 calories a day, and really chow one or two days a week.

And it sort of hit me. . .

I realized that my 1500 calorie intake per day is not eating so much at a deficit as it is that 1500 is how much I should normally be eating to maintain my ideal weight.

To state it another way, I am not eating to lose weight, I am eating to maintain a lower weight. That is not to say I can never go over that, but this is my new reality. My goal is no longer to lose weight, it is really about fixing my messed up eating patterns. The weight is a symptom, not the actual problem.

I never looked at it this way before.

This time it feels very different. It is not a case if “I can’t have that because it is not on my diet” but reprogramming myself to truly understand what it means to eat healthy.

What I have come realize is this:

CICO only seems like calorie restriction, deprivation or a “diet” when compared to the wildly unreasonable modern Western way of eating. ln reality, CICO is really about resetting your calorie needs, your expectations for portion sizes, recalibration of your meal times, and learning to make healthier choices.

This isn’t about calories-in / calories-out, it is about learning to eat for what your body needs after living in an upside down society of completely skewed portions, and incredibly abundant poor food options.

I started this 'journey' in February. I immediately cut sugar and lost 7 lbs, which was noticed in my office.

Three colleagues started in March, but each choosing a different way (Even though I told them I was just doing CICO). One colleague "Jay" decided to buy a pelaton. Another calleauge "Susan" signed up for one of those boxes where she gets a shake in the morning, a shake for lunch, and a bar for dinner. The last "Martia" started on Ozempic + vitamin shots/metabolism boosters.

Martia and Susan not only caught up to me by March, but surpassed me in weight loss. Ozempic was the clear winner, Martia lost 20 pounds in a month, Susan lost about 13, and Jay about 5, me completely 'last' at 3. We are all the same height between 5'2 and 5'4, and we all started at about 140ish.

Martia went down to 105lbs by April, losing 35 pounds in a 2 month period, and the 'Doctor' took her off Ozempic (Honestly I don't think she should have ever been on it but thats for a different thread). She was a healthish weight to begin with; at 105 at 5'3" she was sickly skinny.

At the end of May, I had a close friend end up on at-home hospice care, which turned out to be me giving her morphine around the clock, among other medications, as well as chaning her, cleaning her, moving her, treating bed soars, etc. She ended up dying the first week of June. I did the opposite of diet during this time.

However, as the days went on my habits kept on. I still ate pretty healthy when I was home, as I was just used to eating that way, its what was in the fridge, its what I'm used to buying. Even if I ate out, I ordered what I always have in the past 5 months. I started to exercise about a week after my friends death, just to feel that 'high' again instead of constant depression. It was a rough couple of weeks.

Yesterday, I learned that all three colluagues have either gained all the weight back or more since I disappeared in May. Jay gained her 5 pounds back plus 7 more, although she has not stopped the pelaton and has increased her workouts, she says she has no idea how shes till gaining because shes been eating 'healthy.' Martia has gained back 10 pounds aftering being off Ozempic for 2 months, but honstely 115 is still tiny. She's worried this weight gain will continue and is going back on Ozempic; I'm almost positive she has an eating disorder now. Susan gained everything back plus 3 pounds and is back on her shake diet.

I, on the other hand, lost steadily at 3lbs a month and then maintained my weight for the entire month of June dealing with the pre-death and post-death emotions, as well as errands (I'm the executor). And believe me, when I was on the 24/7 clock care, I ate really really shitty and slept even worse. BUT, my habits really helped pull me through all of that, and although I have not started officially back up, I'm actually at my lowest weight. So yay for CICO and yay for good habits.

I was thinking about this, this morning as for the fourth morning in a row I am having protein pancakes for breakfast.

Growing up I would have been ridiculed for eating something so "unhealthy". Well I have still managed to lose .5kg this week so far eating pancakes for breakfast.

As a kid I was always told that to lose weight you just had to eat salad and vegetables. While that may be the case for some, it's not sustainable.

It wasn't until I started doing my own research and found out I could actually still enjoy food and lose weight, my mind was blown.

In a week I'll eat pizza, pasta, cake, pancakes and still lose weight. I've just made lower calorie swaps while still having some vegetables as well.

Just wish I knew this early so I could have avoided being fat most of my life

Hi all! I've always struggled (on the larger side) with my weight, always loved to eat a lot, and drink many a beer. I got myself into gear after a big break-up and lost 20kg just recently! I love this sub for all the inspiration it gives! For the last year, I've been training in a Powerlifting/Strongman gym. They are both super fun and accepting sports! For this past 4 months, I've been working out with great intensity, twice a day, 4 days a week. I have a great, very experienced coach. I'm training to compete in heavyweight strongman competitions!

However, over the last 2 months, despite working out like a mad person 8 or more times a week, I have actually put on around 8 kg - most of it fat (hopefully a little muscle). I'm feeling strong as an ox however, and have it personal bests in everything.

I guess what I am saying is I am Living Proof that CICO is king for weightloss, the gym is great for cardiovascular health or for strength or training, but if your CICO is out of whack, you're going to gain weight!

Getting fit has millions of benefits, but you will not outrun your fork, so if you want to lose weight it is CICO all the way, with the gym and sport having their own wonderful yet (likely) seperate benefits

TLDR: 10+ hours of gym per week and still gained weight - it's CICO all the way

First things first, some time lurker, new poster, so - hello everybody.

Now, let’s get to the thick of it. I realize the title is somewhat controversial but bear with me, it might make more sense by the end – maybe not though, I’m not sure myself. It’s gonna be a long read regardless, so for the impatient ones:

TL;DR

dropped PUFA – stayed on the same calories – started getting lean fast – started increasing calories – started to become fat again :)

obligatory WARNING: There will be some pics along the read and some of them might be ever so slightly fruity – nothing NSFW but if you definitely don’t want to watch male torsos – don’t click, I’ll provide some commentary for each pic regardless

Now for the long version, some background on me. I’ve sorta always been a chubby kid. Not outright fat or obese but a bit chubby. I’ve also always hated that and so I tried to do some kind of diet for a very long time – mostly unsuccessfully, but it doesn’t matter, I’ve been restricting at least a bit. I also tried some form of gym at least twice before finally committing to it after university. I only have a few pics from that time to illustrate the level of chubbiness I’m talking about here: (, – This is on the lower end of the chubby range – this was somewhere around the time of the second gym rush I had during uni. You can see the body fat at probably around 25% mark, some love handles, a noticeable belly and a precarious waist situation with it falling out of my pants...)

So after a long time fighting and figuring things out – and restricting food is not my vibe, I’m more of an eat your demons away kind of guy – I managed to finally piece together a way to reliably lose weight. Let me introduce you to the hero of our story: calorie counting. I worked out a method that worked for me and started implementing it religiously. At that time it was around 1950 (might even have gone with less – can’t remember) calories daily to cut. And it worked. I lost quite a bit of weight. ( – Much worse comparison quality cause mostly covered up, but you can see I was quite lean at this point – especially by the leanness in arms and face)

At that time I was hovering around the 70kg mark (154lbs in freedom units) – the leanest I have ever been till that point. But I found the calorie counting tedious and bothersome, and I wanted to know if I can manage to get off it and I figured the best way to accomplish that would be to increase my activity at least a bit. Here is the hero’s sidekick: the gym. I started going regularly after I figured out that I need to do it to eat a bit more and not be hungry. Whatever works I guess. And it did work quite nicely. Of course I didn’t manage to keep the leanness, but a lot of the weight I put on was muscle. My weight around that time probably went up to somewhere near 75kg (165lbs). But it seemed there was at least a bit of muscle in it this time. (, A bit more definition and muscle size this time – still a bit fluffy and soft, probably around 18% bf) I continued that for some time along with squeezing in more cardio when I could, walking, biking, those kinds of things. Generally fairly active. And it brought a somewhat satisfactory result ( – Fairly nice muscle definition – visible mid chest striations, some arm veins, maybe around the 15-17% bf mark)

Then a certain virus hit and I lost a lot of the progress I made. The first lockdown I managed to survive somehow, but the second one crushed me. In the end I gained quite a bit of weight, while keeping most of the muscle and ended up with around 83kg (182lbs). So, I decided on another cut with calorie counting. This time I didn’t want to go to the extreme 1950 calories so I decided on a slow cut, 2050 calories and 2150 on gym days. And it worked again. ( – quality is slightly shit, but the abdominal vein here is noteworthy – that’s quite lean, approaching the 12-13% bf range)

Now, I’ve been happily glossing over the whole calorie cut process with a merry and miraculous ‘And it worked’. It’s not that easy and at the lower bf percentages it gets absolutely abysmal. That’s why the second cut was at a lower pace – and also to preserve muscle. But even with this, at the end of it I had to cut the calories a bit more to a flat 2050 and there were days where I was so hungry that right after finishing a good 1500 calorie meal I was still hungry. I was completely full, but still hungry. It’s a miserable time filled with thinking about the next meal constantly. But you power through on sheer will and psychological tricks. And to hell, it works...

After this cut I decided I’m not going back to not counting calories, and besides, it took a good year and a bit to finish it and by that time I was used to always weighing everything and cooking being a pain in the ass. Or maybe I was just resigned – dunno. What I knew is that I had to somehow control the weight better than by eye, so I bought a scale and started noting everything. So here is Pic 8 – the chart:

This chart has the weekly average of my weight from the last 90 or so weeks. The first point is where I finished the mentioned last cut – at close to 70kg (154lbs). Right after the cut I increased my daily calories to 2400 – which is why you see the first peak going up to 74kg (163lbs) – turns out 2400 was way too much. I went back down, this time to 2250. And that’s where I stayed for the vast majority of this chart. I was still hungry quite a bit of the time – but at least not always. And it kept me in the 71-73kg (156-160lbs) range which was very nice considering my body comp continued to change. After that initial peak fell I stayed in that valley number two for quite a bit. This is what I looked at the end of it (, , – First two are fully flexing – the vascularity is very noticeable especially forearms and abdominal, nice chest definition, the biceps has two heads if you look closely – still no six pack though, I don’t have the best muscle structure for this. The last one is less flexed but there is some pump there)

Then I had to move in with my parents for a bit which is what you see under number 3. Still counted, but when mom cooks it’s more difficult. Nevertheless, it wasn’t too bad, a kilo and a bit gained is still within the acceptable range (, – More of the above but with an ever so slight bit of extra fluff)

The end of number 3 is where things start to get interesting and slightly more relevant to this sub. See, what I failed to mention till now is that everything I described here was done eating like complete dogshit. I’m talking weekly McDonalds. A small bunch (30 g, one portion) of chips (I still love you Lays’s Salted) at least every other day. Cooking with sunflower oil, eating large amounts of olive oil (I miss you Panzanella). Generally, not even swamping – just plain crap eating. That’s probably why my daily caloric intake was so low for all this time, I was just torporing myself with this constant PUFA. Right at the end of 3 on the graph and before 4 started I found Chris Knobbe on YT and from there (somehow) FireInABottle and finally through this subreddit Ray Peat. I more or less consumed whatever videos and blog posts there were. Even read about half of Rays blog posts/articles/whatever. And I immediately decided I’m cutting PUFA out completely. And I did. That’s what caused the drastic dip in weight you can see under 5 there. But I became so incredibly hungry constantly that I just couldn’t keep the 2250 calories anymore – I started increasing bit by bit till I finally landed on 2700 and what I am today. That’s what’s caused the peak at 6.

And here’s the gripe that I have with everything I’ve read from Ray, the metabolic health community and whatnot – this shouldn’t really cause me to gain weight this quickly. It’s only 2,7k calories, wtf? Now, it’s possible that I still have some large amount of PUFA in me and that’s throwing everything off. Or maybe the current bf% is too low. But still… turns out even being lean and off PUFA doesn’t guarantee metabolic health.

For now I plan to continue smashing my head against this wall and we’ll see what happens. I hope the 2,7k will become a cutting number and I’ll be able to increase the calories further still but time will tell.

Here’s three more current pics. (, , – 14 was in the dip (5) vascularity is frankly obscene here, 15 is current flexed, 16 is current not flexed – just to show that even I don’t look the way I look…)

I plan gingerly to do an update in a month or two when the results are in if there’s any interest. Maybe the info will be useful to someone. Probably not.

Oh, that small dip at the end there? That was a week of more stearic, like in TCD. I’m doing a ‘normal’ week now and will do another TCD one later. If this pattern repeats, I’ll be jumping into a month of TCD straight – I really don’t wanna do CICO again.