“You are accusing Israel of expelling Palestinians.” jacko

Are you claiming other wise ??.

|| Bont Eastlake: Are white Australian not occupying … Are white New Zealanders not occupying … Are whites not occupying … ||

Are whites and non-whites occupying. Your anti-white bias is showing again.

|| … All the while, their ancestral homelands of the UK, Ireland, Germany or France … ||

…or any number of countries in Africa or Asia. Your anti-white bias is showing again.

|| … havent been swallowed by the Earth or drowned by the sea. Which means white people still have their homeland they can return to. … ||

White people and non-white people still have their homelands they can return to. Your anti-white bias is showing again.

Anyway, my only homeland – the only country I was born in, raised in and have always lived and worked in – is Canada.

you’ve got it wrong again jack. denying Salwa Salem-Copty, or any person, the right to visit a loved ones gravesite is what’s full of malice, childish, petty, hateful and rotten to the core. and you know it too.

Enjoy the rest of your life

you’re a fake. as mooser put it so well, a herd of irrelevance!

Defenseless? The Arab Liberation Army invades from the North

invade what? nazareth and surrounding area were not part of the future jewish state. jewish forces invaded nazareth.

pabelmont,

Venezuela in on the side of the Palestinians, but that could also explain why the US is trying to take full control of the Venezuelan population by funding and arming opposition groups to the Maduro government, groups that attack the Venezuelans in the streets to create an horror situation which they could accuse Maduro of.

Of course, if Venezuela didn’t OWN one of the biggest oil reserves in the world, it wouldn’t have had the US government against it for so many decades, the Chavez government having been a clear example of the usual US’ attempts to steal/control other countries’ important reserves of oil, rare earth, valuable metals, etc. just like it does in North Africa, Afghanistan, etc. There are Gazan off-shore gas reserves, and you can be sure Israel is eyeing them and has already signed exploitation contracts for them with a US company, and the same goes for the off-shore reserves of Lebanon.

you think bush was elected? i thought the elections were stolen for sure. florida and then ohio.

Come on Phil.

Bill Clinton death squads?

Really?

Is this the Enquirer?

I’m not a Clinton supporter and as a baby boomer I’m sadly disappointed that this country chose the Clintons as our representatives to run the country. But both Bill and Hillary have made significant and undeniable contributions to people, especially women and children here and around the world… and they are not murderers.

Anyone who believes all of the conspiracy theories about the Clintons has been infected by Clinton Derangement Syndrome and needs to seek help.

And I believe that anyone who couldn’t vote for Gore is responsible for the deaths of thousands and thousands of people by allowing the bonehead GWB to get elected and the neo-cons to hijack our government.

And anyone who couldn’t vote for Hillary is responsible for the election of the orange Bozo who is rapidly turning this country into an embarrassing mess.

Bont:

“..every other culture outside of the white, Christian strain of humanity..”

What is this “White Christian strain of humanity”?? Christianity has been divided and reformed several times and there is no one Christian strain.

@Jason

Childish pettiness and hate has brought you here. And here your shall remain, swirling round and round in the vortex.

Enjoy the rest of your life.

@Misterioso

“Didn’t (as so declared by Walter Eytan, then Director General of the Israeli Foreign Ministry) Jewish forces and the IDF dispossess and expel about 800,000 essentially defenseless Palestinian Arabs ”

Defenseless? The Arab Liberation Army invades from the North. Local armed bands of Palestinians fought the Zionists from their towns and villages. Jordanian Legionairres, and the armies of the invading armies of the Arab States also fought the Jews.

Six thousand six hundred Jews were casualties of the War of Independence. That number is roughly half the number of Palestinian casualties.

So no. Not defenseless at all.

It would be my pleasure to divest from israel.!

eljay,

«Acceding to Zionist demands for a “Jewish State” in geographic Palestine was a severe error, both morally and politically.»

…and especially militarily, adding also all that Palestinian suffering from résistance attempts, plus the Zionist obvious walls and roads apartheid structures, plus barely hidden genocide tactics, in Gaza, the West Bank and East Jerusalem, and also the Bedouins’ previously left alone territories…

Bont, what bothers me is that you obviously live in U.S.A.?? Why are you living there, if you don’t share “the American values”?? And if the destiny of the Native Americans touches you so much, what is it, you yourself have done to improve their conditions (you are also living on their former land now!!)??

Regarding CitizenC,

Just to clarify, the quote you ascribe to me, that comparisons of Zionism and Nazism had the effect of “calibrating Palestinian suffering by European Jewish standards, and obscuring Palestine,” is not mine at all, but a paraphrasing of the comment of an audience member. For the record, I have put a video of everything that was said on this topic at the Columbia event you cite, both in the talk proper and in the Q&A, here (about 4 minutes);

https://youtu.be/myGUhdJoJfs

Regarding Professor Khalidi, I don’t think it is accurate to say that he “was so upset he had to declare” etc. He was making an unimpassioned, academic distinctions. Nor do I think he “categorically dismissed” the influence of the Israeli lobby, but rather placed it in its relative proportion to other, more powerful elements of US support for Israel.

“White supremacist culture however is malignant towards every other culture outside of the white, Christian strain of humanity. It actively seeks to dominate and humiliate all other cultures different or opposing to it, with unashamed illusions of superiority. Its not the same thing as other cultures raising itself up because white culture puts every other culture down. Thats what’s white culture is. Its the nigger, the Muslim terrorist, the docile but smart Asians, the uppity bitch, the slut, the faggot, the lazy brown people, the dirty Indians, the uncivilized natives. The worthless masses of poor forsaken by God and billionaire prophets..”

Dear Bont,

I don’t know who you are and in which bubble you were born. I most dearly recommend you to travel around the world: India, Africa, the Middle East and what ever place you are talking about. I have seen enough to get speechless “infront of” your comments. When you personally meet little girls who are circumcised, infected and in sevear pain just because of some “eternal” beliefs of no real argument or meet villages where people really bealieve AIDS can be cured by having sex with a new born, I don’t know what you mean at all. It doesn’t need a “White European” to know how to be crule or ignorant.

If the “White World” is so bad as you say, why is there a young Afghan woman (born in Kabul 1984) eleceted as a member of Finnish Parliament and now also working as Deputy Mayor of our Capital City Helsinki?? Why can’t she be doing the same in her first home country, which I am sure she’d be happy to do too. One day she might be our president and I would not mind at all. She shares the same values I do of humanity and what is the most important in this life.

http://static.iltalehti.fi/viihde/21338783_vi.jpg

|| Jerry Hirsch: … the evidence proving the Jew’s 3,000 year habitation of the land of Israel has been thoroughly documented. … ||

People living in geographic Palestine (there is no “land of Israel”) have held all sorts of identities throughout the millennia, including Jewish (or, if you prefer, “the Jew”). This does not grant to either…
– the inhabitants of geographic Palestine; or
– citizens of homelands all over the world who share similar identities,
…the right to establish one or more supremacist states in geographic Palestine.

hophni delivers another scathing cry of antisemitism (323 results found) and you back him up with the power of a steaming bowl of milquetoast. Way to go team ZioS#%$! BDS doesn’t stand a chance against the two of youse!

I hope that Phil Weiss opinion holds right about the end the Clintons, the most corrupt and mafia-like family in the US. How hypocritical Hillary is that she kept mum when her husband Bill screwed around with other women or employed them under his desk. Out of pathological ambition and different sexual preferences, Hillary swallowed her humiliations. More important, however, is that the mainstream media only reported superficially because large parts of the political, financial and liberal elite were involved in the sexism such as the newest revelations show.

Everybody knows that the Clintons “careers” are paved with numerous death. If the US justice system were worth a damn, the criminal couple would have long been behind bars, or even better in Guantanamo Bay!

“Might this action by USA/Tillerson be the straw that breaks the camel’s back…”

I hope so. The usa is dropping the ball on a lot of issues important to the rest of the world, climate change for one. I hope this will be the last straw and other nations will join together and do what the usa refuses to do. Because, for one thing, the so-called american president is way too busy pretending the white house is a plantation and his job is to keep uppity young black men in their place.

Thank you for another excellent article, Mr. Johnson.

Roha,

As we speak,

Are white Australian not occupying a landmass that was already inhabited by the native aborigines? Through the collective organisation known as the government of Australia? Are the native aborigines forced to yield to the laws and orders from this government else risk violent state retribution through the police or army?

Are white New Zealanders not occupying the landmass already inhabited by the native Maoris? Are the Maoris not forced to yield to the laws and orders they never signed up for, in their own homeland?

Are whites not occupying the landmass of Turtle Island through the white supremacist governments of the USA and Canada. Land that were already inhabited by multitude of nations of native Americans for thousands of years. Are the natives not subject to the oppressive laws and orders from the government that happily massacred their ancestors?

All the while, their ancestral homelands of the UK, Ireland, Germany or France…these are all sovereign nations. These countries havent been swallowed by the Earth or drowned by the sea. Which means white people still have their homeland they can return to.

Maoris, the Australian aboriginals, the Native Hawaiians, the various Native American tribes and nations have no other homeland. Think about that.

|| yonah fredman: eljay … the tumult of the years 1881 to 1945 are too extreme for me to have sufficient arrogance to arrogate unto myself the right to micromanage the past that i cannot change one bit. as a result, the establishment of israel is viewed with that type of fatalism, and thus i react to the fact of israel as a given very different from the post 67 situation … ||

Thanks for dropping yet another steaming pile. Nothing prevents you from advocating or supporting justice, accountability and equality in I-P. Well, nothing but your own love of and desire for Jewish supremacism in/and a religion-supremacist “Jewish State” in as much as possible of Palestine.

Mooser,

The point is, Clinton managed to remain in office for the entirety of his two lengthy terms, despite his predatory proclivities. This is an office supposedly most scrutinized by the public, the media and the businesses.

The mere act of touching a woman against her will is considered assault, both in America and pretty much all over the world. Thats the most basic moral standard of any society. To respect women as the other half of humanity, without whom no society no matter how small and simple or how big and complex, can survive.

I mean, if the nation failed to call the highest office into being accountable to the most fundamental measure of morality, what use is having a nation? What use is America? Even cavemen lived by rules pertaining to the welfare of every member of their society.

@Jack Green

Good questions, Jack. Perhaps you can answer them better than I. Why does Israel control Gaza’s borders by land, sea and air? Why does Israel sink Gazan fishing boats? Kill little boys playing football on a beach with naval gunfire? Intercept ships bringing aid to Gaza on the high seas, killing people on board? Have an East German style death strip on the Gazan side of the border?

I said, “try to expel”. To that end, they make life as difficult as possible for the indigenous population of the West Bank. Now, why would they do that?

Even if they had the spine, the US will block it., veto it, or threaten the other nations to not vote for it. The US keeps giving billions of dollars in aid, and the deadliest weapons, for Israel to “defend” itself from home made rockets and stones. The US is complicit in all of Israel’s crimes, including the occupation, and the land grabs. The outrage you see from the US when Israel
announces thousands more illegal settlements is false, because US funding must be helping build squatter land, and the “outrage” is simply an act.

eljay- There’s a scene at the end of one of the bob hope bing crosby road movies where there is an earthquake and as a result of a chasm in the earth’s crust, crosby and hope are thrust on opposite sides and it is that image that divides me from the past, and the tumult of the years 1881 to 1945 are too extreme for me to have sufficient arrogance to arrogate unto myself the right to micromanage the past that i cannot change one bit. as a result, the establishment of israel is viewed with that type of fatalism, and thus i react to the fact of israel as a given very different from the post 67 situation, having witnessed 67 as a semi sentient pre teen, it has a history and a level of acceptance quite different from/than the level of acceptance that i, perforce of deeply taught emotion, attach to the establishment of israel.
many/most israelis seem to find communicating with the palestinians very difficult and thus whatever the specific cause, the lack of communication is not a sign of progress, but regress.

if there are palestinians or speakers of arabic reading this, i would add a mar’habtein, for you are the only ones who break through my fatalism with your presence, particularly when you come with open thoughts or open feelings.

Nick Cave: BDS is the reason for my trip to Israel – Israel News …
https://www.haaretz.com › Israel News

Cave explained that, a few years ago, he understood that he wouldn’t sign an “Artists for Palestine” petition, calling for artists to refrain from coming to Israel. “I didn’t want to sign the petition. I didn’t connect to it. I don’t like lists,” he said.

Cave said he realized that though he wouldn’t sign the petition, he also hadn’t performed in Israel for 20 years. Cave first visited Israel to play a concert in 1993, and has returned twice since.

“That made me feel like a coward, so as soon as I planned this tour, it was important for me to come out against this silencing of artists,” he said.

“I like Israel and Israelis, and it’s important for me to do something of substance about this.”

Cave said he had not played in Israel for the past 20 years due to a lack of popularity and to complex logistical challenges involved in organizing shows.

Interesting. He likes israelis, that would mean the +20% that aren’t jews. But the last line, that he hasn’t played for 20 years due to lack of popularity – does he mean the unpopular venue that is the zionist state, or his personal lack of popularity? Seems like a tool from jump street. Imagine he will make the rounds of photo ops with various nazi officials here. BDS will continue strong without him.

You might have a point Mooser. Is myopia a symptom? It seems Jack has paid a visit and failed to see my question. At least I assume he didn’t see it. If he had he would have answered would he not?

RE: “If Israel is going to retain mainstream political support, it cannot allow itself to become the pet cause of right-wing bigots and conspiracy theorists.” ~ Stephens

SO: Israel should not take advantage of the zealous support of “right-wing bigots and conspiracy theorists”, but it is perfectly kosher for Bret Stephens to take advantage of said “right-wing bigots and conspiracy theorists” to smear JVP. *

* RHETORICALLY ASKED (WITH SEVERELY PURSED LIPS) : “Well, isn’t that special?”** (frequently followed by “How con-VEEN-ient!”)

** ANSWER: I’d say its more like “too clever by half”, Church Lady.***

*** WIKTIONARY:

■ too clever by half – https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/too_clever_by_half
English
Adjective
too clever by half
(idiomatic, of a person, plan, theory, etc.) Shrewd but flawed by overthinking or excessive complexity, with a resulting tendency to be unreliable or unsuccessful.
▲ quotations
• 1890, Henry James, chapter 47, in The Tragic Muse:
[H]e had a damnable suppleness and a gift of immediate response, a readiness to oblige, that made him seem to take up causes which he really left lying, enabled him to learn enough about them in an hour to have all the air of having converted them to his use. . . . He was at all events too clever by half, since this pernicious overflow had wrecked most of his attempts.
• 1914, E. W. Hornung, chapter 8, in The Crime Doctor:
The poor devil was too clever by half, and made a big mistake for each of his strokes of genius.
• 1993 March 21, Robert Dallek, “Roosevelt Unbound,” New York Times (retrieved 26 July 2012):
Historians generally agree that Roosevelt was too clever by half, and that he miscalculated badly in assuming that he had the political muscle to alter the size of the Court.
• 2011 April 28, David Prosser, “Did Barclays’ own executives see the bank coming?,” The Independent (UK) (retrieved 26 July 2012):
Still, the thing about being just a little too clever by half is that it tends to catch up with you.

P.S. (I.E., PARTING SHOT)
RE: “How con-VEEN-ient!”
QUERY: Cognitive dissonance much, Bret?

Well said, Donald. It needed to be said too. Especially these days, when a groping by some political figure gets far more attention than collusion with or even the outright order of murdering people willy nilly in other parts of the world (I have Yemen, Iraq, Libya and Syria in mind, for starters).

I can’t get over the fact that GHBush is accused of the crimes of groping but not the crime of bombing people into dust. War crimes don’t matter because they happened to other people in parts of the world we don’t care about. But inappropriate touching or groping – assuming it took place – even decades ago – now that’s a major crime.

Same twisted moral standards with Bill Clinton –

Not belittling the victims of inappropriate behavior on the part of powerful people. Only questioning how we rank different levels of victimhood, and how we exclude so many from even being viewed as victims, oftentimes, because it was the US’s policies that generated the victims in the first place.

But that’s how it’s always been with Empires. Dehumanize others living on the edges of the Empire, but god help the gropers inside the Empire.

Well, that’s why the Romans referred to those germanic tribes as barbarians. In other words, fair game. In due course, it was of course the “barbarians” and the vandals who swept into Rome, but not to worry – the US is still way away from that.

“these cultures do not pretend to be enlightened or civilized beyond who they really are. They don’t try to impose their understanding of society and the world onto others as universal fact. They don’t engage in cultural imperialism that devalues native culture and way of life,”

If you really believe this, you need a lot more history lessons.

Because of course, public opinion is manufactured to spec.
In other words, opinion is parroting.

That looks like at least a good start to pinning down the notion of a legitimate resident, though I think there are probably a few ways of being a legitimate resident.

Income tax offices usually have a few ideas about residency. Of course, they want to extend it as far as they can.

https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/International-tax-for-individuals/Work-out-your-tax-residency/

(And perhaps you could favour Jerry Hirsch with your ideas about group rights.)

Might this action by USA/Tillerson be the straw that breaks the camel’s back, the camel here being the refusal to act by the EU, South America, maybe a few other states? How long can they put up with the USA-Israel thumbing their noses at international law and international comity and international everything? In other words, I am asking the nations, “Have you, at long last, no decency?”

“Saucy blue eyes, … a well-turned ankle.”

Dammit, sir! Show a little restraint. Such lascivious imagery is not healthy for a gentleman of my years.

@Jackdaw

Utterly irrelevant. More drivel.

Didn’t (as so declared by Walter Eytan, then Director General of the Israeli Foreign Ministry) Jewish forces and the IDF dispossess and expel about 800,000 essentially defenseless Palestinian Arabs (the indigenous inhabitants of Palestine) between late 1947 and the fall of 1948? As well documented, they accomplished this by means of armed force, several massacres, mass rape and intimidation. They also destroyed over 500 of the Palestinians’ towns and villages while seizing 78% of Palestine, i.e. 22% more than the 56% the recommendatory only Partition Plan suggested? (Nor should we forget that a further 25,000 Palestinians were driven out just before and during Israel’s 1956 invasion of Egypt as well as an additional 250,000 during and after Israel launched the June 1967 war and invaded and occupied the remaining 22% of mandated Palestine)

Since June 1967, Palestinians in the West Bank and East Jerusalem have been subject to an illegal and brutal occupation in violation of the UN Charter and the Fourth Geneva Convention. (BTW, Israel is still belligerently/illegally occupying Syria’s Golan Heights and Lebanon’s Shebaa Farms and Kfarshuba hills.)

Eminent Jewish Israeli journalist Bradley Burston aptly sums up the horrors Israel inflicts on Palestinians in the occupied West Bank and occupied East Jerusalem:
“Occupation is Slavery”
EXCERPT:
“In the name of occupation, generation after generation of Palestinians have been treated as property. They can be moved at will, shackled at will, tortured at will, have their families separated at will. They can be denied the right to vote, to own property, to meet or speak to family and friends. They can be hounded or even shot dead by their masters, who claim their position by biblical right, and also use them to build and work on the plantations the toilers cannot themselves ever hope to own. The masters dehumanize them, call them by the names of beasts.” (Haaretz, Feb. 26/13)

As for the Gaza Strip, to this day if remains belligerently and illegally occupied by Israel.
To wit:
Human Rights Watch, 2005: “…Israel will continue to be an Occupying Power [of the Gaza Strip] under international law and bound by the provisions of the Fourth Geneva Convention because it will retain effective control over the territory and over crucial aspects of civilian life. Israel will not be withdrawing and handing power over to a sovereign authority – indeed, the word ‘withdrawal’ does not appear in the [2005 disengagement] document at all… The IDF will retain control over Gaza’s borders, coastline, and airspace, and will reserve the right to enter Gaza at will. According to the Hague Regulations, ‘A territory is considered occupied when it is actually placed under the authority of the hostile army. The occupation extends only to the territory where such authority has been established and can be exercised’. International jurisprudence has clarified that the mere repositioning of troops is not sufficient to relieve an occupier of its responsibilities if it retains its overall authority and the ability to reassert direct control at will.”

The International Committee of the Red Cross: “The whole of Gaza’s civilian population is being punished for acts for which they bear no responsibility. The closure therefore constitutes a collective punishment imposed in clear violation of Israel’s obligations under international humanitarian law. The Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949, ratified by Israel, bans collective punishment of a civilian population.”

“In practice, Gaza has become a huge, let me be blunt, concentration camp for right now 1,800,000 people” – Amira Hass, 2015, correspondent for Haaretz, speaking at the Forum for Scholars and Publics at Duke University.

“‘The significance of the [then proposed] disengagement plan [implemented in 2005] is the freezing of the peace process,’ Prime Minister Ariel Sharon’s senior adviser Dov Weisglass has told Ha’aretz. ‘And when you freeze that process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state, and you prevent a discussion on the refugees, the borders and Jerusalem. Effectively, this whole package called the Palestinian state, with all that it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda….’ Weisglass, who was one of the initiators of the disengagement plan, was speaking in an interview with Ha’aretz for the Friday Magazine. ‘The disengagement is actually formaldehyde,’ he said. ‘It supplies the amount of formaldehyde that is necessary so there will not be a political process with the Palestinians.’” (Top PM Aide: Gaza Plan Aims to Freeze the Peace Process, Ha’aretz, October 6, 2004)

In short, Zionism is racism; Zionism is theft; Zionism is fascism.
The good news is that it is doomed. No one understands this more than ever increasing numbers of young, enlightened Jews around the world who are abandoning Zionism and its spawn, the anachronistic entity known as “Israel.”

No. But if you do give into your lower impulses, what can a woman do to protect herself? She can’t do anything because the differences in physical strength. That knowledge alone is a potential motivator for rape.

MOOSER- “Well, “Keith”, being that you were the one who introduced…the phrase “Gentile society”, and with a capital letter, I’ll leave it to you to define it.”

We have discussed many times the fact that during the period of Classical Judaism, Jews were a minority that functioned as service nomads (Slezkine) within a surrounding community of non-Jews, aka Gentiles. I always capitalize both “Jew” and “Gentile.” What do you need defined? Jew? Gentile? Society? Surrounding?

MOOSER- “Then we can explore or rather, unpack the meaning of the phrase “the Jewish struggle for power”.

All of human history is strongly influenced by the struggle for power among various competing groups including Jews. For the Jews, this struggle has primarily involved economic activity designed to increase the wealth and power of the tribe/community. In our current phase of capitalist development, Jews have been extraordinarily successful in this area, a fact that numerous Mondoweiss articles attest to. Politically, the Israel Lobby (writ large) is an example of solidarity combined with financial power to overwhelm the opposition. Is any of this controversial?

As I indicated, I have come to the conclusion that Jewish financial success, dependent upon struggle as all such activity is, is not the recent success of a downtrodden group which suddenly sprouted wings, rather, it represents a continuum of generally historically successful activity dependent upon group solidarity. My readings support this conclusion. However, if you wish to “unpack” these conclusions, have at it.

|| Jerry Hirsch: Eljay, ask Phil if he is a Jew based on belief or by descent. Maybe you’ll take his word for it. ||

I’ll take Phil’s word that he either:
– underwent a religious conversion to Judaism; or
– is descended from someone underwent religious conversion to Judaism.

Well and truly said.!!!

hirsh, learn the definition of ethnic cleansing before spouting your demographics nonsense.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing

Let’s hope the king is killed and the House of Clinton falls before Bonnie Princess Hillary can stage another return in 2020

Very interesting. I had a similar thought at the time. And I agree it is important to distinguish what is still theory from what has been proved. That does not mean all theories should be dismissed. Much detective work begins with a theory or two.

I agree about being wary of a theory that explains everything. The practical problem with those theories is usually that they cannot be disproved. No matter what evidence is brought up, the theory is morphed to fit it. Adding to the confusion, whenever there is a big gap in evidence there will be multiple theories to fill it. In the world of science, evidence eventually rules out all but one.

In this case the powerful people theory is prompted by a lot of specific evidence, readily available to those who go outside the mainstream media. This evidence is in the many apparently illogical decisions of public servants, and in the testimonies of highly placed insiders, such as Kay Griggs, Ronald Bernard, and Col. L. Fletcher Prouty.

And these theories are not new. British novelist and Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli brought this up in his novel “Coningsby”. Vicious power struggles among the financial elite are an ancient phenomenon. Cleopatra had to have her brother killed in order to survive herself. Today’s details remain to be revealed, but there is plentiful evidence that something of this sort is still going on.

The term “conspiracy theory” is used against you when you find out what is really going on.

Phil, where is this NE that was under British occupation in the 1700s?

Thanks for the link to the absolutely excellent Ronald Bernard interview. I agree he seems highly credible. I found it interesting that he was abused as a child to a significant degree. This is typical for people who lack a “normal” level of empathy. Also believable is the use of mob tactics of control, escalating from bribery to physical harm. These patterns are also seen among the non-elite. But the power of the financial elite lets their pathology be destructive on a more massive scale. Their powerful inner hate and turmoil, leading to a drive to destroy, including self-destruction through alcohol and drugs, matches the portrait painted by Kay Griggs (link below, description above).

Kay Griggs interview part 1.

I wish everyone here would focus like a laser beam on Jewish privilege. Maybe then we could win for once. Jewish privilege is the only reason the Palestinians never win.

Jackdaw

What’s your point? We all know what hypocrisy is. Israel continues to operate an apartheid state and a brutal racist occupation. Last I checked Australia does not partake in any of these – Australia offers equal rights under the law

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B

“Men in general are vulnerable to lapses in judgement and morality when it comes to women, simply due to their physical advantage of them.”

So true. We are ever in the thrall of a pair of saucy blue eyes, and only too ready to be ruled by a well-turned ankle.

“Citations? Examples? Hyperlinks? Evidence?”

“Hophmi” gives us all the evidence here, in his diagnosis of Phil’s Jewish self-hatred,, which gave us a chance to understand Phil’s affliction, even tho we must condemn it.

Brewer, at the current rate of Palestinian population growth, statistics prove conclusively that there is no such thing as “incremental ethnic cleansing” in the disputed territories.

West Bank and Gaza population

Year Pop. ±% p.a.

1997 2,783,084 —
1998 2,871,568 +3.18%
1999 2,962,226 +3.16%
2000 3,053,335 +3.08%
2001 3,138,471 +2.79%
2002 3,225,214 +2.76%
2003 3,314,509 +2.77%
2004 3,407,417 +2.80%
2005 3,508,126 +2.96%
2006 3,611,198 +2.94%
2007 3,719,189 +2.99%
2008 3,825,512 +2.86%
2009 3,935,249 +2.87%
2010 4,048,403 +2.88%
2011 4,168,860 +2.98%
2012 4,293,313 +2.99%
2013 4,420,549 +2.96%
2014 4,550,368 +2.94%
2015 4,682,467 +2.90%

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_Palestinian_territories

Norman Finkelstein has stated, including recently to Katie Halper, that he agrees with this, although he is careful to state that it is still in the realm of speculation.

No, Elizabeth, I don’t think he has, but he’s used the term of the mistakes of others!

The ability of the hypothesis of ‘controlling influence’ to explain all those things that otherwise don’t make sense is the reason why you should be wary of it. Its compatibility with all phenomena means that ir’s hard to fit into an objective discussion of the world.

Atlantaiconoclast, Israel has had seventy years to ethnically cleanse all the Palestinian Arabs, instead they make up 20% of their population.

In comparison, the Arab countries of North Africa and the Middle East ethnically cleansed 99% of the Jews after 1948. What were the Arab leaders thinking? Where did they expect 850,000 Jews to settle?

hophmi, excellent point!

Keith,

“The Ashkenazi Jews who founded Zionism had zero physical association with Palestine”.

Genetic evidence says otherwise.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3032072

RoHa,

“The Palestinians are mostly descendants of the people who lived in Palestine before the Arab conquest. They are called Arabs because they took to speaking Arabic.”

Do you have evidence of that? You do realize that Rome and it’s successor, the Byzantine Empire had colonized the land for over 600 years. It was then a Greco-Roman province with a Jewish minority.

Genetic evidence also shows the Palestinian Arabs to be in the same gene pool as the Saudi Arabians, just as would be expected by the historical evidence of the Arab expansion during that time period.

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-e7274c91049cad57c0e84d13dbe831d7-c

“not over yet.still one place to go.”

No, that’s alright, I’ll send out for pizza.

RoHa, the right of self determination is one of the major principles contained in the U.N charter.

Chapter 1, Article 1, part 2 states that purpose of the UN Charter is: “To develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples, and to take other appropriate measures to strengthen universal peace.”

Where is this set of arguments you say you presented against this cornerstone of international law?

“jonathan ofir- you preach to the converted. so cheerleading rather than propaganda is the proper label for your rhetoric.” “yonah fredman”

WS “preach” (16)

WS “cheerleading” (3)

WS “propaganda” (107)

Offered as an aid to understanding.

On an interesting connection. The co-owner of Cave’s management company is also (one of?) owner of Radiohead’s management company.

Lyn117,

Genetic studies prove the Khazar theory is a myth.

Elhaik’s work supporting this theory has been thoroughly debunked. He had no Khazar DNA to compare to so he substituted Armenian and Georgian DNA instead.

Flawed science equals flawed opinions.

http://forward.com/news/israel/175912/jews-a-race-genetic-theory-comes-under-fierce-atta

“I think that Spain decided a few years back to offer citizenship to any descendant of the Jewish people expelled in the days of the Catholic Kings. This became difficult to do meaningfully…,” mhughes
It is actually fairly easy to prove meaningfully for legal purposes. Here on Mondo people often engage in abstract logical acrobatics, seeking of absolute moral truths, pseudo scientific genetic debates, etc. In civil law, a much simpler standard applies, what a reasonable person would think. So I very much qualify as a Bulgarian Jew. My family name is Catalan, my grandparents spoke Ladino and it is a matter of general agreement that the Bulgarian Jewish community has Spanish origin. All this search for absolutes makes for a good logical game but in practical terms everyone knows who is a Sephardic Jew. I didn’t take advantage of the offer because by the time it was made I was already an American citizen. But were I to go to the Spanish embassy, they would immediately understand the heart of the matter. My religion is of no consequence in this, it’s just a thing you know in your gut. As a philosopher you tend to seek complexity when none is needed.

Eljay, ask Phil if he is a Jew based on belief or by descent. Maybe you’ll take his word for it.

” A sex crazed lunatic with nonexistent respect for basic morality, managed to hold the highest office of the land for more than a decade.”

Not the usual criticisms of FD Roosevelt, but who am I to contest the prevailing narrative?

Keith, your denial of DNA evidence that clearly shows a genetic link between the various Jewish groups is baseless. You haven’t shown a shred of evidence to support your claim.

Here’s mine.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3032072

“My question to you is, which group retain title to real estate and which do your ancestors belong to?”

Hold on. In order to retain the rights, they would need to breed only within that particular group of Jews.
At any rate, the deserving recipients should be easy to spot.

I think most people who profess “concern” over Palestine dispute that Zionism equals racism and genocide. I attended a talk by Tom Suarez about his book “Terror State”, based on material from the British official archives, at Columbia, moderated by Rashid Khalidi. The audience seemed less interested in the latest details on the Zionist-Israeli horror show than in meta-answers.

During his talk, Suarez said that comparisons of Zionism and Nazism had the effect of “calibrating Palestinian suffering by European Jewish standards, and obscuring Palestine”, so he rejected them.

During Q&A I conceded Suarez’s point about calibrating suffering, but argued that Zionism and “Jewish identity” generally had to be acknowledged as Jewish racialism, as powerful as German voelkisch ideology in the 1930s.

A guy who identified himself as a former defense attorney at Gitmo said that the corruption of law by Israel was comparable to Fascism.

The Israel Lobby also came up. In response there was a whiffleball statement about “strategic asset” by an apparent undergraduate.

Rashid Khalidi was so upset he had to declare, “as a historian”, that comparisons of Zionism with Nazism and Fascism were inappropriate, because “these developments were all local and contingent and unique”. A questioner stated that “of course Zionism isn’t as bad as Nazism.”

Khalidi also dismissed the Israel Lobby categorically. “For the US and Britain, it’s always been about strategic interest”.

Not to single out Khalidi, but I think his is the prevailing viewpoint, certainly at outfits like Jewish Voice for Peace and its effective subsidiary, US Campaign. The long history of Zionism as Jewish racialism, including its collaboration with Nazi Germany, and the critiques of Zionism and the “Jewish people” idea as racism by Jewish writers like Elmer Berger, has been buried by the Jewish left, and most Palestine supporters have gone along. JVP and others still vilify critics of the Israel Lobby as anti-semites.

there were some murmurs from clinton initially about improving relations with Hussein’s iraq, then the Bush assassination plot came to light and . . . poof, enough of that talk.

January 14, 1993|By New York Times News Service.

Clinton, in an interview with The New York Times, said he was not “obsessed” with Hussein and that he could imagine a normal relationship with the Iraqi leader, provided he behaved in accordance with international norms.

see this technical discussion of competing narratives on where the alleged bomb materials originated from.

https://oig.justice.gov/special/9704a/05bush2.htm

In April 1993, former President George Bush visited Kuwait to commemorate the victory over Iraq in the Persian Gulf War. During Bush’s visit, Kuwaiti authorities arrested 17 people allegedly involved in a plot to kill Bush using a car bomb.

Whitehurst alleges that he compared the explosive material in the main charge of the Bush device to explosive materials in known Iraqi devices and told Explosives Unit Chief J. Christopher Ronay that the explosives were different. Whitehurst claims that Ronay purposely misinterpreted these results in order to link the explosive material to Iraqi agents. Whitehurst further asserts that very possibly his results were changed to support the retaliatory missile strike by the United States.

|| yonah fredman: … the occupation of the west bank seems to me to be a severe error, both morally and politically … ||

Acceding to Zionist demands for a “Jewish State” in geographic Palestine was a severe error, both morally and politically.

“The core of Gentile identity is not being Jewish? I never thought of it that way and I suspect that I am not alone.”

Well, “Keith”, being that you were the one who introduced (” I have come to believe that the Jewish struggle for power within a Gentile society is the historical norm”12:33am) the phrase “Gentile society”, and with a capital letter, I’ll leave it to you to define it.
Then we can explore or rather, unpack the meaning of the phrase “the Jewish struggle for power”.

I also wanted him to resign. It would have been a very positive action. It might have saved Al Gore? Myself I was so turned off by the Dem Party that I couldn’t vote for Gore in 2000. My mother is still angry at me over this and goes on about Nader in FL, of course. Though I guess I’d voted for Jesse Jackson thru the 90s….
Kirsten Gillibrand now says Bill should have resigned.

I should have made the point about Sudanese pharmaceutical plant, which btw was related to impeachment scandal. My post thus serves Donald Johnson’s point, citing Chomsky, that we distract ourselves with follies while the real scandals are unaddressed.

Pastors played an important role in the 1700s in NE in justifying violent resistance to British occupation, leading to rebel militias, etc.
Clerics seem to play a similar role in Gaza.
Religion is a human activity that would seem to serve shitty causes and historically-validated ones too.

I have always felt deeply betrayed by Richard Goldsone’s “if I had known then what I know now, the Goldstone report would have been a very different document”.

Many felt that the pressure on him was enormous, and he faced being cast out from his family and from his community.

But what if the pressure was way heavier than that? What if some pro-Israeli supporters threatened his family with harm?

He is neither stupid nor evil. He must have known that any walking back, even to express the regret for the font size used in Goldstone Report, would be enough for his report to be hasbara’ed to to the ground and turned to dust, and will open Palestinians to repeated Israeli attacks, the horrors of which he must have been fully aware of.

46/53

It is a coherent and plausible scenario, explaining action which was sudden, morally incomprehensible, and followed by withdrawal from public eye.

I agree with that scenario too. But I dont think it’s a banker or a hitman, I think he wears a general’s uniform, or a spook’s.

I think that Spain decided a few years back to offer citizenship to any descendant of the Jewish people expelled in the days of the Catholic Kings. This became difficult to do meaningfully, partly because there can be on,y a few who can prove beyond question that they are qualified and partly because the number of people who actually have at least one relevant ancestor must be enormous and would include many whose families have not practised Judaism for centuries.
My idea – don’t know what RoHa would think of this – of a legitimate resident is someone living in a country and contributing to its economy/political life or qualifying for a place in its social security system. This would be so provided that the person is not reasonably regarded as having destructively superior loyalties elsewhere or as having entered illegally or violently in circumstances not yet resolved by treaty, amnesty or the general consensus of humanity. I’d add people in anomalous situations whose expulsion could not be contemplated humanely.

If only the ICC or other international organizations had the spine to investigate Israel’s crimes against humanity, and the dedication to follow through with the consequences (sanctions, criminal prosecution, etc).

JW: You got a URL or whatever on Kit Griggs ? I’ve found nothing on Google.

BTW, I “buy” your theory. I always imagined that on day-1 of a new presidency, the secretary brought an unknown man into the oval office who said to the new president, “Mr. President, congratulations; and now let me explain the rules of the game to you.” Of course, he was more likely to be a banker than a hit-man, but your remarks suggest there may sometimes be little difference. One has to ask why so many politicians (especially democrats) feel bound to support the oligarchy (take money from and then act on behalf of the BIGs: big-defense, big-banks, big-pharma, big-Zion, etc.) Was it only money? But of course, enough money stops looking like “only” money.

Kit Griggs ? Appears to be from fiction or movies. True?

BTW, I “buy” your theory. I always imagined that on day-1 of a new presidency, the secretary brought an unknown man into the oval office who said to the new president, “Mr. President, congratulations; and now let me explain the rules of the game to you.” Of course, he was more likely to be a banker than a hit-man, but your remarks suggest there may sometimes be little difference. One has to ask why so many politicians (especially democrats) feel bound to support the oligarchy (take money from and then act on behalf of the BIGs: big-defense, big-banks, big-pharma, big-Zion, etc.) Was it only money? But of course, enough money stops looking like “only” money.

” It was a Christian’s duty to forgive, not to judge. ” The pastors were, there, closer to what I dimly understand of Christian official theology than the folks who were busy, some years back, lynching black men upon thin allegations of rape by white women. Or to much of Evangelical Christianity today ( https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/evangelical-christians-are-selling-out-faith-for-politics/2016/06/23/f03368de-3964-11e6-8f7c-d4c723a2becb_story.html?utm_term=.06921add0db8 ).

It seems that religions, which were once tight and unified in theology & belief and, largely I suppose, in behavior, have come apart and anyone can claim to “be” a religious “Christian” or a religious “Jew” . Here in USA, most religious Jews would say (and act) that murder is wrong, whereas in Israel it appears to be quite otherwise, and the religious (and other) Jews here are (largely) supporting the Jews in Israel as if it were a moral matter.

I wonder if Jews in the USA supported clear criminals who were Jewish ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jewish_American_mobsters ) just because of a supposed duty to stand up for Jews everywhere irrespective of what they were/are doing.

And I guess these “Christians” will continue to support Trump and the awful Republicans in Congress who are voting to send all the “safety-net” money Americans used to enjoy to the bank accounts of the already super-rich just because those Trump/Republicans “feel their pain, anger, envy, fear” about black-people, immigrants, gay folks, etc.

In this case it looks like the bds campaign has backfired:

http://m.jpost.com/Israel-News/Nick-Cave-Im-performing-in-Israel-because-of-BDS-514610

John Perkins, author of “Confessions of an Economic Hit Man”, outlines a game plan for dealing with leaders that do not favor US corporations – first bribery, then regime change if that fails, then assassination as last resort. If there is one thing that identifies the US it is a game plan that can be used time again.

There is further support for this from a Dutch banker, Ronald Bernard. Part 1 of a 3 part series:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRuKmxQSPSw

He may be acting. If so, that is real Oscar material.

As for two key things about Clinton (male), there was the bombing of the Sudanese pharmaceuticals plant, directly and indirectly killing innocents as the plant supplied 50% of Sudan’s medical drugs.

Then there was the destruction of Yugoslavia, and enabling ‘carefully vetted Islamic rebels’ who delighted in decapitating Serbs (game plan reused in Libya and Syria).

As for Clinton (female) there is the infamous video of her joy ‘ We came, we saw, he died’ following Gadaffi’s butchering by Islamists (ISIS flags were flying in Libya within months). There is video evidence that the ‘we saw’ part is true as a US SF guy was present filming Gadaffi from his capture right up to his murder, and another video of Clinton receiving a cell phone message detailing his capture.

It didn’t:

“Nick Cave: BDS Is the Reason for My Trip to Israel …

“In a manner of speaking, BDS was the impetus for coming to play in Israel,” musician Nick Cave said at a press party celebrating his show which will take place on Sunday and Monday night in Tel Aviv.

Cave explained that, a few years ago, he understood that he wouldn’t sign an “Artists for Palestine” petition, calling for artists to refrain from coming to Israel. “I didn’t want to sign the petition. I didn’t connect to it. I don’t like lists,” he said.

Cave said realized that although he wouldn’t sign the petition, he also had not played a show in Israel for 20 years. Cave first visited Israel to play a show in 1993, and has returned since twice.

“It felt wimpy. The second that we left for this tour, it was important for me that we come out against silencing artists.

“I love Israel and Israelis and it’s important for me to say something of substance about this.”

Cave said he had not played in Israel for the past 20 years due to a lack of popularity and to complex logistical challenges involved in organizing shows.”

read more: https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.823612

Ah well, another “wimpy” and too busy person who doesn’t care about the genocide and ethnic cleansing of the indigenous Palestinians of Palestine. He’s a schmuck who only “loves Israel and Israelis”.

Another real schmuck who willingly ignores the truth. Ugh.

jonathan ofir- you preach to the converted. so cheerleading rather than propaganda is the proper label for your rhetoric. the ministry of explanation and the ministry of truth. no, the two don’t sound similar to me, but to your audience that is eager to nod and applaud, it is useful rhetoric.

in fact the occupation of the west bank seems to me to be a severe error, both morally and politically and it will most probably remain the primary factor in my experience of Zionism (and close to primary vis a vis Judaism) for the rest of my lifespan, so i take the problem seriously. i viscerally reject bds, but it is visceral rather than logical. and bds is a secondary issue compared to the occupation which is primary.

people who oppose both the occupation and bds will get fewer and fewer soon. so i understand your gleeful tone.

“As a distinct ethnic group, the Jews have the right to self determination. To seek self rule in their native lands…”

There are at least four claims here.

1. The Jews are an ethnic group.
2. Ethnic groups have at least one right.
3. This right is the right of self-determination, which I interpret as the right to establish a state.
4. And to establish it in “their native lands”.

I’ll let everyone else deal with the first, and MHughes deal with the second.

In respect of the third, I have presented a set of arguments to show that it is false. Do you have any arguments to support it? If not, we can justifiably regard it as a self-serving fiction.

And do you have any arguments to support the fourth? For that, you will have to clarify “their native lands”. Literally, that would mean the lands they were born in, but it is pretty clear that you think that Palestine is the native land of Jews born in Poland and Argentina. But if you mean “the land their ancestors were born in”, you have to decide which generation of ancestors. As Mooser points out, it seems that all our ancestors came from part of Africa.

That claim seems, at this stage, to be doomed.

Have you got anything better to offer?

“Israel does not have two different economic ecosystems, like, Israel within the green line and Israel over the green line. If you want to divest from the West Bank, Judea and Samaria, you have to divest from Israel, which means you boycott Israel completely.”

Well that’s pretty definitive and much much easier. The ‘settlement’ labels are a joke and there are too many ways to muck up the works. From the mouth of bigly habara , the entire ‘state of israel’ is a settlement and therefore should be boycotted in total. For anyone still on the fence about ‘israel’:

U.S. Warns Palestinians They Could Lose Washington Embassy Over Abbas’ Call to Investigate Israelis

The Trump administration to the Palestinians: Without entering serious peace negotiations with Israel, the U.S. could shut down Palestinian diplomatic delegation
Haaretz 18.11.2017 14:28 Updated: 2:29 PM

WASHINGTON – The Trump administration has notified the Palestinian Authority that unless it enters serious peace negotiations with Israel, the U.S. could shut down the Palestinian diplomatic delegation in Washington, D.C. within the next few months.

The message was relayed to the Palestinians by the U.S. State Department recently, but it did not include a firm timeline. It was first reported on Friday by the Associated Press.

U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson told the Palestinians that this decision was reached as a result of statements made by Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, who called on the International Criminal Court to investigate Israel and prosecute actions by Israelis.

The State Department said that the statements made by Abbas go against a U.S. law which stipulates that the Palestinian mission should be closed if the Palestinians try to take action against Israel at the ICC.”

The palestinians can’t continue to the united states to do anything but support the rogue ‘state’ of israel – they are basically one in the same. I hope that other more enlightened, honest and humane leadership in the zionist bubble outside of the united states and the bastard state of israel will step up and assist with their petition to the ICC.

It has been pointed out here before, but I think it’s important to note that we really aren’t even talking about dual loyalty here because for many Zionists their only loyalty is to Israel.

“This will happen – it is only a question of when,” Jerusalem Affairs Minister Ze’ev Elkin said, “adding that it could be anywhere between the next 10 to 20 years, depending on the pace of construction.”

No, no, no! The issue is the pace of DESTRUCTION and that is increasing daily. They have to DESTROY before they construct. Are you getting that at all MSM?

Why so, Yonah fredman? It’s exactly the point. Many do actually know that ‘pravda’ means ‘truth’, and that this ‘truth’ was state propaganda. Israel’s ‘explaining’ is precisely of the ‘truth’ it believes to need to ‘explain’.

If this is the only issue troubling you, I’m flattered.

In reality the ROR is a living fact. Resolution 194 enshrined the Palestinian ROR. Israeli Government agreed to implement it in return for Full Membership in the UN. Israel has never honoured it. On that basis the UN would be within its rights to suspend Israel until it does.

We are seeing the fall of an empire built on the blood and bones of millions of innocents. What does it matter if the Democratic party is going to suffer politically. A sex crazed lunatic with nonexistent respect for basic morality, managed to hold the highest office of the land for more than a decade. Followed by a sociopathic buffoon who saw no problem in killing millions in faraway land to get what he wants. Trump, a malignant narcissist with zero self awareness seems pretty okay compared to what was before.

If the presidency attracts such low characters, what do you imagine the lower rung positions of the state is filled by. The school administrators, the public health officials, the housing board. The police. The courts and the prison system. The entire thing is rotten to the core, naturally considering the circumstances in which the state was created in the first place.

Bret Stephens is a writer? And is there more than one of him? And all this time I just thought he was a very unsuccessful comedian.

Roha

Of course other cultures and nations have faults of their own. But then again, these cultures do not pretend to be enlightened or civilized beyond who they really are. They don’t try to impose their understanding of society and the world onto others as universal fact. They don’t engage in cultural imperialism that devalues native culture and way of life, and rob them of their dignity as fellow human beings.

How other cultures conduct themselves is their problem, no matter how problematic we may find their ideals and actions to be. If Chinese want to see themselves as superior to others, or Indians wanting to practice endogamy, thats their business. As long as they dont infringe upon the right of others to live as they choose to.

White supremacist culture however is malignant towards every other culture outside of the white, Christian strain of humanity. It actively seeks to dominate and humiliate all other cultures different or opposing to it, with unashamed illusions of superiority. Its not the same thing as other cultures raising itself up because white culture puts every other culture down. Thats what’s white culture is. Its the nigger, the Muslim terrorist, the docile but smart Asians, the uppity bitch, the slut, the faggot, the lazy brown people, the dirty Indians, the uncivilized natives. The worthless masses of poor forsaken by God and billionaire prophets.

Thanks hophni! Leave it to you to miss the entire point.

Thanks Jonathan for proving that the term liberal can never be paired with the term zionist. Eshkol was prime minister 50 years ago, during the Johnson administration, and now we’re 9 presidents past Johnson and the situation has, predictably, become worse. There are no excuses left for ‘liberal zionists’. They can’t claim they didn’t know, didn’t see, didn’t understand. They didn’t care. They believed their rabbis/youth leaders/Hollywood bullshit. Shame on us.