Booty or buddy? Avoiding the ‘Friend Zone’
Emma-Kate Dobbin
Thursday, February 17, 2011 at 05:20pmA guy once said to me: “Well maybe we should stay friends; you can never have enough friends.”
That was after I told him I saw him as a mate not a date.
Only I’m from the school that you certainly can have enough friends.
Potential lovers, now that’s a different story…
What is it that makes people decide you are one or the other?
It’s a question many single men and women mull over when they want to go from “mate” to “date” and can’t understand why people see them as being “just a friend”.
Is it romance, magic, passion, boredom or a combination of all of these depending on the timing?
Maybe, but there is also another factor when dating… and it’s something I call the “Friend Zone”.
In case you don’t know what that is, it’s basically a treacherous situation which happens in the early stages of dating…
When an action or behaviour makes people decide they are into you as a buddy rather than seeing you as booty.
Can you avoid being put in the Friend Zone?
If you’re dealing with a woman, then often no…
It can be something as simple as a location that stops the romance and makes them see you in a different way: “More like a brother, than boyfriend” as my friend Tina put it.
Or it could be a pair of ugly Crocs draining the chemistry and smacking you in the face with a “maybe I don’t fancy you - maybe you are just a friend” reality.
Cara, 32, said women were more prone to suddenly putting people in the Friend Zone.
“We don’t always tend to be cut and dried as men with the friend or lover tag,” she said.
Of course (understandably) this can all get very tiring for the blokes.
“How do you know if you are in the Friend Zone with a woman?” lamented reader Tony, 23.
“You don’t. One minute they are into you and decide that they’ll invite you to dinner and a movie - all the date-like qualities - but without the kiss goodnight.”
Another female reader has her answer: “Sometimes, you’ll be into a guy, but a man needs to have a certain chemistry, to make you want to get it off with him. Chemistry is a fickle beast. It can be there… and then...it’s gone…”
But there does seem to be one friendship factor that always seems to work in a man’s favour with certain women – a “hot female friend”.
“I HATE it when a man has a ‘hot female friend’ who doesn’t stop hanging around and treating him like it’s her boyfriend. (Then) I instantly have to have him!”
Wing woman … the ultimate man’s accessory?
Can you avoid the Friend Zone? Are there things men do that they should avoid while dating if they want to avoid the “mate card?” What about guys? Are you often put in the Friend Zone and how do you avoid it? Do women do things that makes you think of them as a mate rather than date?
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Emma-Kate Dobbin
Journalist Emma-Kate Dobbin tells you what she’s learned about the workings of the male mind and the opposite sex.
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I make friends with women sure, and I have some good female friends that I have never dated, but if I date someone then I don’t want remain their friend after the fact.
I think SSR has been right in the past, you have to seriously demoralize a women to make her realize you are better than her, and make her want you. When they see the evil bad tempered bong smoking you, thats when the coin is flipped and they think they are better than you and you are relegated to the friend zone.
I don’t know if women do it more than men either. For me its been about 50-50. There are some women where I think, you know what, I really can’t be bothered once I start to know the real them. Things that have made me switch off almost instantly and think ‘mate’:
refering to exes;
explaining in great detail fights they have had with their friends to try and get you onside;
repeating stories;
trying to pry my thoughts out of my head;
talk frequently about past drug use or being wasted;
poor table manners;
no sense of humour;
not returning texts in a timely fashion;
too many texts;
not playful;
cancelling on me without a good excuse;
smell weird;
Own cats;
Live with their parents;
have owned ponies;
vegetarian;
unemployed;
work as a hairdresser or bar chick
have ever been a sex worker
have gross tattoos
have gross peircings
insist on watching Glee or other girly shows.
have short hair
have red hair
call me mate
are fat
will not at least swim when at the beach
make small talk about the weather.
All I ask for is a fun attractive competent girl and a blow job. Do I ask too much?
Thu 17 Feb 11 (06:59pm)
Thu 17 Feb 11 (08:09pm)
*edited. I would never use girly as an adjective. Could we have settled on gay?
Yeah I know the BJ bit is like asking for everthing ‘to go’ at a Maccas drive through. It just goes without sayin, aye.
Yeah 50-50 is about right, But women are more insidious when it comes to not letting men know they are in the friends zone. I’m pretty blunt, or will at least have the politeness to get the message across to someone I don’t want as a potential gf by treating them with passive indifference. You know, behave with a slight air of ‘go away’.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (08:27pm)
What’s wrong with redheads??
Not a bad list otherwise. And if you stop asking for blowjobs - you’ll find a woman who will happily oblige. As EK says - we get it.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (09:41pm)
Who wants to be mates with anyone who has bad table manners or who goes into details about fights? That’s just flat-out avoidance material there.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:27am)
I would argue that some men are woefully bad at being too sleazy when on a date with you that it automatically leaves them in the ‘no go zone’. A somewhat recent date kept contacting me afterwards with ‘so… are you going to show me your piercing one day....’ ugh. I would have caught up with him again had it not been the overtly explicitness in his communication with me, it grossed me out.
Maybe i’m the rare blunt type that i just tell men when i’m attracted to them and when i’m not i usually say something along the lines of ‘i’m happy to catch up socially but no sex stuff or romance as i don’t wish to waste your time’ no point giving mixed signals.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:29am)
No, Gigi. Just a liar. You would give mixed signals like a set of traffic lights in a cyclone. It’s what women do. Drama keeps you guys “interested.”
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:38am)
Gigi, totally right on the sleaze factor too. Have had a couple of guys ruin it by texting photos of their packages or asking about certain things way too soon!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:49am)
Potatoes, one thing. No sense of humour? I don’t know about you but I have rarely found an attractive, intelligent (enough) woman with a great sense of humour. Women find Two and a Half Men and The Big Bang Theory funny. When you put on a little classic Richard Pryor they start thumbing their skirt wondering where you hid the cocaine.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:51am)
Taters, Bec would call you mate.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:32am)
SSR - bite me. Not up to your usual standard of entertaining wit and sarcasm this morning.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:16pm)
Stop projecting, Gigi. This flesh is off limits to your canines.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:53pm)
SSR - I HATE 2.5 Men. And I find it’s men who like it the most!!! Charlie Sheen’s little boy act is old news.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:32pm)
Raz, How I Met You Mother? Mike and Molly?
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:59pm)
They exist SSR. So long as they find me funny they don’t have to make me laugh. I just hate the ones that frown upon my antics, especially when I’m drinking.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (07:19pm)
How I Met You Mother? Mike and Molly?
EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW! Sorry they make me puke a bit. Give me Dexter, House, Insight or The Office.
PS be nice to Gigi, she seems alright.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (09:08am)
50/50 potatoes you are full of shit.
A Friendship zone is nothing to do with the guy. All it is is the girl has picked another guy, and puts the other one on the backburner as the friend.
Once you realise this you can have pretty much any woman.
Sincerely,
Mon 21 Feb 11 (10:20am)
“make small talk about the weather”
Depends on the conversation for me. If its a stinking hot day, I think its perfectly legit to comment on the weather. Comments like “it was such a hot day, I’ve been walking around in my underwear indoors” can make small talk about weather a bit interesting too
I might add, constantly talking about wanting blow jobs to my “friend zone”. WE GET IT!
But on a more serious note—I do think you are right. Men and women do do it 50- 50.
Emma-Kate Dobbin
Thu 17 Feb 11 (07:44pm)
The friend zone is not something I have been able to work out. A guy with a bit more game than I might be able to avoid it, but at times I cannot.
For all those people who will spout BS about “being clear what your intentions are upfront” helping you avoid the friend zone- you are wrong. It might help sometimes, but if you are destined for the friends zone being upfront does sweet FA.
To avoid the friends zone guys should:
-be physically attractive
-tease her playfully
-appear like a strong, independent guy with many social and employment prospects
-treat her as though you like her, but could happily go after another girl.
Girls get in my friend zone by:
-not being feminine
-not appearing like a loyal and caring person
-not being physically attractive.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (07:27pm)
Thu 17 Feb 11 (08:11pm)
Well Smidge - i think you’re too physically sexy for most women to put in the friend zone… but you forgot one more thing that i (even as a sci-fi lover) cannot find ‘sexy’ and regales men to the friend zone
** a bedroom full of Transformers figurines - i mean hundreds of them..... ** seriously, are you like 10 years old???
good list though - have to appear confident enough to not be desperate for attention and not sleazy that you’ll hit on any woman with two legs.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (08:40pm)
Everyone gets ‘friended’ at somepoint - unfortunately we’re not to everyones’ taste. And I think if you’re out there asking people out it is likely to happen eventually (unfortunately).
But I think for guys;
-be physically attractive
-tease her playfully
-appear like a strong, independent guy with many social and employment prospects
-treat her as though you like her, but could happily go after another girl.
is on the money. Actually, I think it works for chicks too.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (10:48pm)
Smidgeling, I have to agree with some of your ‘to the friend-zone bin’; but from the perspective of a female.
For me, the most guaranteed characteristic to send a guy to friend zone is :-
1. I’m not attracted to them (but enjoy their company)
2. The defer to me for everything. I’m a strong person, with a strong personality, but I don’t want someone that makes me feel like some kind of butch lesbian with a girlfriend as a partner. I’m heterosexual, and still want a man to be that.
Otherwise it’s just a personality thing. You can’t want to be in a relationship with everyone that you like…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (06:00am)
Nice comment Smidge. I agree with a lot of what you are saying. In particular about girls who you put in the friend zone.
To stay out of the friend zone I do the following:
Get a girl alone away from her friends (sometimes easier said than done)
Physically escalate the situation via touch.
If you follow those two steps it is impossible for her to see you as a brother as you will be sexually aggressive.
I will not stay friends with a girl I find attractive who has rejected me. It is not worth it for my mental health and many girls want to ‘stay friends’ only to avoid negative emotions on their part. Some girls actively collect as many guy friends with unrequited feelings as possible to boost their own self esteem via attention-whoring.
Not all women are like this, but I am no woman’s handbag. There will be sex or I will take my presence elsewhere.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:38am)
Smidge, as horrible (and wonderful) as it is to say, just stop caring. The guy’s hot girls like don’t care. Imagine if you had a bevy of beauties vying for your attention, would you care? Adopting the attitude, delivers the results.
Treat women like uninvited guests on your mantastic adventure and you’ll have more women than you can poke your stick at.
One last little nugget, never take a thing that comes out of a woman’s mouth seriously. Ever. When she’s angry, make fun of her. When she’s proud, subtly belittle her achievement. When she’s confident, ease the carpet out from under her fragile little ego. Every woman I’ve ever met, no matter how attractive, has been very insecure deep in her cute little heart. Remind her of that often. She’ll love you for it.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:42am)
“Physically escalate the situation via touch.” Well have to admit that helps with dumb blondes like me. I tend to approach most people as friends because a) scared of rejection, b) I’m shy and I think it’s rude to assume every guy wants to jump you.
So it helps if the guy indicates physically early on if they’re keen. Means I can respond appropriately too.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:49am)
Smidge - not true! My best mate is male and I was actually attracted to him when we first started talking back in highschool. He is attractive, intelligent, getting far in his career and a wonderful guy! He is actually what I see as my “ideal partner” in all aspects - buttttttttt he’s been my bestie for 7 years and is DEFINITELY in the “friend zone”.
Basically I see him like a brother and couldn’t imagine ever getting intimate physically with him, because it would be plain and simply weird!
So I do think it’s nothing to do with looks or anything. I think like all things there’s a window - a time frame for these things. If you don’t act quickly enough, once that window closes, you hit “friend zone” territory! Funny thing is, he actually told me he loved me at one point which totally made things weird for a while, but all is well now! He’s actually my “35 and still single” back up plan haha!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:39am)
Bear, I’m guessing you need a lumberjack or maybe a contestant on World’s Strongest Man or even a Spetsnaz hand-to-hand instructor.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:28am)
@Gigi
But if said guy has a vintage Optimus Prime or Jazz from the 80’s, isn’t it sexy to make out with them looking on
Anyway I raise your Transformers call to a bedroom full of soft toys… cats, dogs, teddy bears you name it!
Seriously that is five red flags.
@Smidge
It depends how you ‘declare your intention upfront’ doesn’t it?
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:29pm)
Lulu, I don’t think we disagree on anything there…
Sad- I know. I just have difficulty keeping up the front at times, but yes, I know it works.
Gigi- I shall respond by private email...heh.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:40pm)
Gosh, but wouldn’t that be GAME PLAYING?
Grow up.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:12pm)
@ Chaos - haha - ummm no, i do love Transformers, and all kinds of retro children’s shows, sci fi - i just dont want to be surrounded by them in the bedroom - eeeuuk. Keep them in the lounge room with all the cool stuff - then i’m impressed and will love the quirkiness.
yep i agree with the female version of doileys everywhere or soft toys, not enticing or alluring.
so, yes Optimus Prime rocks - just keep him out of the bedroom, or at least limit it to only a couple of figures.
What would u define as sexy in a woman’s bedroom though guys?? Just ouf of interest.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:32pm)
oops- If I could attract the girls I wanted without playing games, I would. Blame attractive women for expecting me to play ball.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (02:22pm)
Yeah, oops, the game playing sexually valuable women demand. AKA want to bang a hotty, you have to get the hamster a spinin’.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (02:54pm)
Lulu, you may single handedly revert humanity back to the Stone Age. Thanks for being the unfunded actor of the script I related below.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (04:25pm)
@ Gigi
An attractive women with little or nothing on
Sat 19 Feb 11 (10:25am)
SSR, it sounds an awful lot like you’ve been studying the ‘negging’ thing those so called Pick Up Artists do? Constantly manipulating the women so that you stay ‘higher’?
In my opinion it may work for pretty/insecure women, or if you are extremely good looking, but most women who want a real relationship wouldn’t put up with it for too long… well, I know my friends and I wouldn’t, anyway.
Just my 2 cents
Sun 20 Feb 11 (08:54am)
Then do you not realise how many potential partners you’ve let fall by the wayside because you insist on pursuing the vapid game players to satisfy some ridiculous idea that you deserve a good looking woman? Then my friend, quite frankly you do deserve all you get - endless hours of chatter about nothing but shoes and hair extensions, expectations beyond your salary, then unceremoniously dumped when she finds someone hotter and richer.
I have no issues with your frail ego that must be adorned with a hottie, but quit blaming the game on them when you are dictating exactly the same rules. You’re no different and no better. And quit whining about it.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (09:45am)
Right, kristenroxy83, so you’re a pretty but insecure woman looking for an extremely good looking man to work on your insecurities for some time.
Projection is a wonderful thing.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (09:57am)
Oops- you poor, poor fool. I wouldn’t *date* a woman like that. I like to be able to talk to my partner. I like someone of substance. But why wouldn’t I sleep with a hot woman?
Also, I think you need to get in touch with reality and meet the vast majority of women out there. Not all women who play games during the attraction/flirting stages are shallow and cheats, but they do like games.
I’m not sure you can avoid the friend zone in some instances - if the physical attraction isn’t there nothing will make it magically happen. (oh i’m just waiting for comments about men having money and being objects of lust)
I have quite a few male friends, none that i’ve ever dated as i feel it’s a tad awkward to stay friends with someone you may have been intimate with or if emotions got hurt in the process of knowing them. Most of my male friends are funny, some are nerdy, all are easy to talk with and respectful towards women.
Confidence and the ability to flirt with women will definitely help get you out of the friend zone - the most charismatic men i know will subtly flirt and touch a woman to let her know she is sexy without giving the impression of groping her. Women like to feel desirable and special and if you give off the impression you love women’s company and are not desperate we like you even more.
On a side note - Adelaide Fringe is on and i saw a preview of a very, very funny show about dating and picking up - the comedian was advising both women and men to be confident in their own skin, have something visibly ‘striking’ people can comment on and for men to go out on a limb and tell the beautiful stranger on a bus, cafe that ‘she is beautiful’ and walk away without a backwards glance, just for the sake of making someone’s day and leaving an impression.
So what makes me think of a guy more as a friend - well, if they stimulate me mentally and make me think and laugh, if they tease playfully, confidence in themselves, intelligence and ease of conversation. Oh, and a man that smells nice - guys who smell good are definitely sexy.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (08:24pm)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:00am)
Or in a more condensed format: anyone who can get the rationalisation hamster spinning and keep him that way.
Make you think and laugh? I’m sure you giggle like a school girl around men you find physically attractive. Nattering and tittering like Stuart Little in a Barbie Ferrari as you gaze up at their chiseled features, wondering if your own cute but not stunning physicality is enough to squeeze you over the line into requited lust. I bet you over share. I bet you laugh in all the wrong places. I bet your little cheeks ripen like the first apples of the new morn as he sweeps his broom-like fringe from across his forehead.
Sure you need to be intellectually stimulated, Gigi. A cock-sure and handsome gadabout with the social cache of the Fantastic Mr Fox could steal your heart in a moment without ever uttering anything more complex than:
“Hey.”
or
“Sup.”
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:43am)
@Gigi
Confidence definitly radiates. People like other people who are sure of themselves and comfortable with what they do.
People don’t like people who need assurance from other people on what to do.
Example of two people (same looks) asking you out:
One:
I would like to try this restaurant/bar etc… would you like to join me on X night? Never been just want to check it out. Heard great reviews. Etc...
Two:
Are you free on Tuesday? Wednesday? Thursday? Ok. Would you like to go out on your free night? Ok. What do you want to do? Food? I like food. What sort do you like?
Which would you prefer?
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:58pm)
Writing your little addendum doesn’t magically remove your culpability for the idiocy of your original statement.
Denis Rodman said once, when he was about nineteen he couldn’t get a date, he hit his twenties, same thing. No one found him attractive, he was too weird. Then he signs with the Chicago Bulls and models want him and men offer him money to have sex with their wives.
A recent study proved that women orgasm more often when having sex with men who are wealthy. There is something about the security of knowing you will never have to put in your fair share that makes women melt. It is a biological, physical fact. Deny it at your humiliation.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:05pm)
@ Chaos - great example - subtle difference in scenario may mean the difference between seeming confident versus ‘i’m needy’. nobody wants needy - unless you are perpetually attracted to lost causes.
SSR - sad, sad, sad. Are you psychic - if so, quit your day job right now. You paint an amusing picture of me - somewhat cute but inept in social settings around cute men.... that shows you read most of my comments and trying your well publicised tactic of making feel embarrassed or inferior -seeing as you state it makes women want you more. Well done Freud....
I like who i am, i’m sexy, confident and intelligent - men like that also.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:36pm)
Irrational self esteem is not attractive in women.
And mumbling an affirmation to yourself when riding the bus doesn’t make it true.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:38pm)
Sad - Please post the links or at least the title of this peer reviewed and published study you have mentioned. I would be most intrigued to read it.
They didnt ask for my comments for the study - thus probably not applicable to me. How money = more orgasms or sexual satisfaction is beyond me.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:48pm)
Enjoy, Gigi.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article5537017.ece
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:49pm)
Gigi
News reports and the discussion of the study are below.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article5537017.ece
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-therapist-is-in/200901/do-wealthy-men-give-women-more-orgasms
Mon 21 Feb 11 (10:37am)
Thanks guys - i’ll have a read tonight - should prove interesting reading.
Much appreciated.
Hmm yeah everyone will friend zone someone in their life. Usually because you don’t find them attractive in that sense. Then again sometimes they can cross the line into ‘booty’… if they’re special.
I have to admit it’s a turn off (and therefore friend zone) if they are clingy and needy. Or if you have to be in charge all the time. Or if they watch reality TV.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (08:34pm)
The truth of the matter is, why would I expect any person I’m with to *not* have the same positive qualities my friends would have?
I am admittedly not the classiest person in the world. I have supped beer from my fair share of ashtrays in the short time I’ve been on earth. But overall, the people I have as my friends are generally people who are top people: fun to spend time with, great conversationalists, intelligent, progressive, courteous, talented in their own way. Presumably, the hypothetical person I would want to go out with would have the same virtues but I would be attracted to them. If I weren’t attracted to them but they were still fun to be around, why wouldn’t I want them as a friend?It’s not like I have a cut-off. If they don’t have those virtues, they wouldn’t be relegated to the “friend” zone: they’d be relegated to the “pass their phone number onto the Scientologists and inform any passing Nigerian prince that they are always keen to help a mate out” zone.
A chick’s not attracted to you? Well, them’s the breaks, friendo. Just as you aren’t compelled to go out with some lady you don’t find attractive, nobody *has* to go out with you just because you like them. You can either spruce yourself up and give it an honest shot, or live with it. Or actually *tell* her of your feelings and intentions and handle the consequences. Nobody is clairvoyant, despite what the batshit insane pedlars of new age faffery might say.
(And honestly, if you’re unable to be friends with 51% of the population, that’s your defect - not theirs.)
Thu 17 Feb 11 (09:55pm)
I guess what would make me put a guy in the ‘friend zone’ is not really wanting to jump his bones in some way… if there’s no spark or chemistry.
Now as to my strange fish I’ve been dealing with of late, he still seems (and seemed from the start) to want to jump my bones (seems sexually attracted), yet freaked out at the possibility of something closer when I asked if he was interested in it (i.e. emotional AND physical closeness or proper dating) and so now I’m around someone who has put me in the ‘friend zone’ relationship wise, yet continues to act like he’s thought/thinks about sleeping with me and also like he does have feelings.
How weird is that…
Is there an in-between zone I am not aware of that I’ve been placed in?
Something in the vein of a John Mayer lyric - “I’m never speaking up again, It only hurts me, I’d rather be a mystery, Than she desert me...”?
If so, I’m wondering if some guys (especially guys that may have been single for a long time) are complete wuss bags when it comes to making the transition from ‘mate’ to ‘date’, assuming ‘date’ means genuine potential intimacy across many levels, not just a f*ck buddy…
Thu 17 Feb 11 (10:32pm)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:27am)
@T he is scared, nothing more nothing less.
You represent change in his world and it sounds like he has built some really spectacular walls around his little hidey hole.
You do have to consider that he may actually be a weird little peice of work inside those walls rather than a prince in exile. The fairy tale ending is not always on the cards.
Either way as he has shown no intention of lowering the drawbridge you will have to do all the work of scaling the walls, and he is likely to get even more freaked out and maybe even sabotage your efforts depending on how threatened he feels.
You do have to ask if it is worth it. Are you viewing him through rose coloured glasses or are you seeing the reality.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:30am)
Turquoise- do you have so little self respect that you’d let a guy act like this towards you? Move on dude…
Putting up with this type of BS is exactly the type of thing that would make me see you as nothing but a friend. And all the guys around you are probably the same, including the guy you’re hooked on.
Bottom line- some people are just screwed up and not worth trying to figure out.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:34am)
T,
Men are different to women. When a man’s heart has been whacked, the last thing he needs is another relationship. All I’ve ever wanted to do is pump and dump for a few months, maybe 12 or more. That kind of attitude, where excessive starfishes are used, has led me to discard wonderful women while still smouldering at the skank with bad hair who upset me.
T, women are confusing when they’re in peak form. Men who’ve been hurt don’t want to replay all that confusion again. We don’t trust women anymore, so we want rebound, excessive, meaningless sex. I still crave that, and I’m trying to maintain a relationship, which is the toughest thing I’ve had to do in years.
So, why don’t you try what my chick did.
And ask what happened in the past to make me such a misogynistic, sexist competitive man. Ask. What happened? Why are you like this. Tell him he has nothing to fear.
That’s what my chick did.
Of course, I didn’t believe her, and I was about half honest, but it gave her a little insight.
She tried to ensure I could trust her, and I don’t mean in a cheating sense, but that I could trust her motivations…
Cheers
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:54am)
Turquoise, you need to tell him that what you want and imply that if he won´t give you what you want then you are going to look for it elsewhere. Say it in a nice way of course, but say it to him. The trick is actually doing what you say you are going to do. This isn´t meant to be a bluff, but a statement of intent.
There´s nothing wrong with going after what you want and getting it from where you can get it. If a girl is not giving me sex for instance (except for a few valid circumstances), I will get it from another girl.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:54am)
Turquoise - dump him! If he’s not looking for the same thing as you, there’s no point in still hooking up. My bet is he needs someone there, but doesn’t want to be in a committed relationship. He knows that’s what you want, so he keeps the idea there by being close, but not so close with you in order to keep you around. Been there, done that. Don’t waste your time.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:02am)
Smidge...
No, I do have some self respect…
I’m just not used to people this screwed up as I’ve had pretty healthy, long relationships i.e. ‘I like you, you like me’… simple.
It’s taken me a little while and some unnecessary confusion to work out I have absolutely no idea what planet he is living on…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:55am)
No T, guys who have been single for a long time just realise what a sh***y deal it is to lose their freedom between a womans legs.
He wants a sexual relationship not a romantic one. Wouldn’t you leave too if someone was demanding you take a deal you dont want?
If you’re wondering why guy’s only want sex from you then its time you did some introspection.
Guys will always tell you you’re wonderful to ensure the supply of sex/potential sex is not cut off. But what he says and what he thinks are two different things.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:17am)
@ Turqoise
Sadly this situation is not weird. This guy is trieing to turn you into a ‘friend with benefits’. There is no way to convert him. No way. Pull the paracute while you still can. Get out of there and land to safety. Some guys are douches. Some aren’t. Find one who isn’t.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:56am)
FYI all...
We’ve never hooked up. Thank God.
We’re not together. I simply thought he may be interested in dating properly, you know - something that other emotionally healthy, regular, homo sapien males who are want a woman in their life would be interested in doing.
Even that idea scared the crap out of him. Hence why nothing evolved. I wasn’t going to settle for being a FB even if he’d suggested it, which he didn’t.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:15pm)
Alastair,
Nah, guys don’t only want sex from me. They probably would if I let it happen, but I’ve never allowed that to happen once.
I’ve yet to meet a man who is smart enough to outsmart the innate insight I’ve always had into people. I seem to be able to see through people quite easily.
I suppose that’s why I tend to like the quieter types. There is more truth (and more interesting things) at the centre of them than some ape with big pecs and nothing to offer mentally other than a doughnut-in-a-thought-bubble aka Homer Simpson. Plus, many good men are usually too genuine/shy to have the confidence to act too smooth. There’s something nice about that.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:49pm)
Turq, the problem with asking for advice here is you’re only going to get everyone’s own projection of what their behaviour would be in the same situation.
No one knows why he’s doing it except him, either ask him wtf it’s all about or walk away. For all you know he could be waiting for the genital warts to disappear.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (04:32pm)
@Turquoise
Must be nice to have superpowers
I’m not disagreeing with you but not all athletic men are apes…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:41pm)
One day our paths may cross, Turq.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:36pm)
Turquoise, I have been in the same situation. At first, I thought he was in it for the long run… but when the topic of taking it to the next step was brought up, he freaked out.
I realised he was only keeping me close so I could be his fcukbuddy whenever he’s in town when after his failed relationship, he came back saying how sexually attracted he is to me, hoping something could happen between me and him!
I have too much self respect to even entertain the idea.
Sat 19 Feb 11 (03:01am)
T, not sure if this will help, but I would never personally consider a ´relationship´of any kind with a girl unless I´ve had sex with her.
Its a pre-requisite because I don´t want to waste time and sexual compatibility is very important to me. This doesn´t meen I won´t go on a few ´dates´ beforehand with a girl if I think she is the quality. It just means I won´t have any talk about emotions until things have moved on a fair bit.
You could be coming off as needy. I´m just saying..
Sat 19 Feb 11 (11:49pm)
When I read this, he sounds a lot like myself. I got put in the friend zone a few times, that was ok, I wasn’t interested anyway. And then I did what he is doing to you, to a few women. With me, I was looking for the big “L” not the FB or a hook up and what caused the reaction was doubt. Women often shoot their mouths off far too much -"too much information”. Another way of getting that response is to do the ego thing and demonstrate how many blokes you can pull, that happened to me a few times - supposed to make me jealous, made me do runner real quick.
Then I had a couple where i just couldn’t put my finger on it but instinct told me to take evasive action.
I met the Big “L” been really happy for a long time, the one thing I can say is that as time went by, my actions were completely vindicated and I am so glad I kept my distance as their lives are a mess and they would have made me absolutely miserable.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (10:49am)
Turquoise....
Did you ask whether he was interested in a relationship or was he interested in sex? Some guys freak out about women who are up front with converstations about sex, before the deed has been done.
While he may just be shy, even shy guys will get up the nerve to make a move if they’re interested enough. I suspect he is putting off making a decision about what he wants with you while he waits to see if something better will come along.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (12:36pm)
ByStealth…
It is possible, yes…
But all I basically wanted to know was whether he was interested in me as more than a friend… i.e. if he was interested in dating or just being a mate… I wasn’t asking if he loved me (!).
I was getting very mixed signals which indicated he felt/was attracted quite a bit but scared to fully act, which were in turn was making me feel confused and sort of sad, hence why I had to eventually ask. I thought to myself ‘I’d rather ask upfront than feel this way for another few months...’
We did go out for a drink (he asked me) but since he hasn’t been with someone (a girlfriend) for ages (years and years) I did get the feeling he was pretty nervous when out.
If he’d been clear on that date about wanting to get to know me more i.e. said at the end ‘that was really lovely thanks’ or asked me within the next week to go out again, I’d have left it.
But instead of a second date (we cross paths daily) offer all I got was blushing, nervousness, what seemed like ramped-up attraction vibes (more so than BEFORE we went out) coupled with an almost scared ‘avoidance’.
If he’d just been chilled out and we’d have gone out a few times I wouldn’t have put the hard word on him i.e. ‘What do you want exactly’.
It was lack of clarity - attraction one minute, what looked like fear the next - that unfortunately forced me to ask, even though I didn’t want to, to make myself feel better one way or the other.
Of course, he still seems interested now which is of course spectacularly confusing, but the ball is now firmly in his court.
My old housemate told her ex exactly the same thing as they were breaking up; he’d been a bit of a knob their entire relationship, and when they broke up he did the whole, “let’s be friends - you can never have enough”, and she responded that in fact, she did have enough friends, and that he wasn’t one of them.
Thu 17 Feb 11 (10:52pm)
Adding to Potatoes list
Disrespectful
Gold digging
Demanding money
Not being able to say sorry when clearly in the wrong
Sexual talents of the 1800’s era and or sex drive that of 90yo
Fiy - 6fig salary mid 30’s am so so tired of Aussie girls, like many makes my age who just dont want the crap any more we are opting to either go to our country of origin ie. im Eouropean or oriental younger girl eg 6 to 8 yr younger because cougars are fun until you live with one.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:07am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:06am)
May I suggest latinas and eastern europeans. Many of these girls act with a femininity that is hard to find among many modern australian women.
Love that femininity…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:13pm)
I approve of your addition to my list.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (10:55am)
I know women do demand money, but there are lots of us who like financial independence. I’ve never been able to figure out how women could demand money, or date/marry someone simply for their money.
in reply to Potatoes & Smidgeling: I can’t see how you even make ‘the friend zone’!! Really quite shallow. From my point of view two people must be good friends and actually enjoy one another’s company and get on well, and have things in common before considering being anything more than friends. I’m attracted to the person’s inner qualities. If those things exist then it’s really quite easy to find them irresistable and want to take things to the next level. Of course this is a deeper bond I’m searching for and not a booty call. To answer the next question, YES! this kind of relationship does exist (I have one), and men can be real men too. There are no games! No wonder so many women are happy to be single after reading these replies!!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (06:51am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:36am)
I’m interested to hear what is shallow about wanting a girl to be loyal and caring.
Women expect a man to be masculine, so I see femininity as equally valid.
Of course you’ll pick up on the looks thing. Well, You’ve got to find your partner sexually attractive and it’s not just about inner qualities alone.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (12:28pm)
I cannot reinforce how strongly I feel about this.
Ladies, if you have trouble keeping a man, consider how feminine you are.
The friend zone - Its like the twilight zone, it very easy to get in it, but very hard to get out of it.
To avoid (as a male that is) you must appear your own person early on. Not be too available or friendly. Have your own view on things and not agree with everything they say. Essentially be independent and show that you could get a date with someone else if you pleased.
The guy must push the sexual tension early on (without going overboard). If you haven’t kissed within the first three dates (whether it is specified as a ‘date’ or not), you are almost 80% likely to be in the friend zone. In fact the kiss test is the biggest way to tell if you are in the friend zone, if she pulls away from a kiss… Well say no more.
For girls to get in friend zone, its easy, the guy doesn’t want to have sex with you. Or if you are attractive, you have some other massive red flag, like an army of ex’s or other guy friends that follow you around. Or your dad is in mafia or something like that.
Yes, having a female wingman can work. It means you have been accepted by females already and it makes you more approachable. Its why guys on the prowl, shouldn’t hunt in packs. However it must be blatently clear the women is not your girlfriend.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (07:17am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:22am)
So very wise Chaos - i agree with everything you have said. The kiss within three dates thing, so true - it just gets to the stage it becomes awkward and you may as well hug your plush toy instead.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:41am)
Chaos, a recent scientific study proved that having sex on the first date, does not in any way hamper the potential for a future relationship. Thus, you’re not really a man until you’ve been knocked back by a red cheeked princess for, “moving too fast.”
Put out or get out girls. You want the relationship BS, provide the goods.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:59pm)
“a recent scientific study proved that having sex on the first date, does not in any way hamper the potential for a future relationship”
I think that’s part BS SSR. What about all those guys who say over and over again ‘I would never have a relationship with a girl who slept with me on the first date. It means she’s a slut who’s sleeps with every guy on the 1st date’. So they nix it. I’ve heard guys say this heaps of times.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:43pm)
Your limited subjective experience aside, Raz, if the guy is open to a long term relationship with the girl, it really doesn’t matter when they sleep together.
I wouldn’t hang around with a slut, but I’m not looking for a long term relationship. Just a string of progressively more erotic casual dalliances. The way mother nature intended.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (07:27pm)
SSR lets leave my so called limited experience out of this
I suppose it doesn’t really matter when people sleep together, it just depends on what they are looking for.
I just find it funny that some men (and women) divide women into the slut or Mother Theresa category.
It encourages those games we despise. I just try to look at people as ‘people’. I get more funny stories from them that way.
1) be attractive;
2) don’t be unattractive
Fri 18 Feb 11 (07:21am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:47am)
And when in doubt, puff out your chest, look down your nose, and tell her the way it is, not the way she thinks it is. Never fails.
Example:
“Do you like How I Met Your Mother?”
You could lie and say:
“It’s okay.”
But it is way more effective to tell the truth and say:
“I think your taste in TV is as subtle as your taste in clothes.”
This will get her rationalisation hamster spinning with questions like:
“Does he think I’m stupid? Does he think me clothes are slutty? Does he even like me?”
Which of course then leads to:
“I’m going to tear my dress off and ride him like a jet ski at the Hawaiian pipeline.”
I’ve always hated this ‘friend zone’ theory - because it seems to put pressure onto people to get a ‘result’ in the first few dates, otherwise you might as well give up. Do we really need more people with such short attention spans?
Personally, my relationships have always been born out of friendships. I can’t imagine being intimate with someone I’ve only seen a few times! For me, familiarity leads to intimacy, not the other way around. So I like to be friends first and if we’re genuinely compatible intellectually, emotionally and we’re at a similar point in our lives (we want similar things), then there’s a chance of taking it further.
But any man who forces an awkward kiss on the third date because he’s following some stupid rule and ‘otherwise he’ll be in the friend zone and will have to give up’ is an immediate turn off.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:24am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:13am)
I´ve lost girls because I haven´t escalated things quickly enough and I´d rather lose a girl by pushing things too quickly than by not grabbing my balls and acting when I have the chance.
Windows for moving things forward can be so fleeting and if you don´t know what you´re looking for it can easily lead to missing them entirely.
I agree that hard rules like sex on the 3rd date are crap. As Captain Barbossa says ´We consider them more like guidelines´
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:57am)
@Bev
Its only awkward if there has been no implied sexual chemistry in your dates. If there isn’t any at all he’s in the friend zone already. Thats why its awkward. Some people may be able to date people in ‘friend zone’ but you’re the rare exception rather then the rule.
Think of your male friends. How many of them would like to be in a relationship with you? Then think how many could actually have the relationship with you.
Anyway, rules are meant to be broken. If you have found a formula which gives you a solid and satisfieing relationship, then go for it.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (05:59pm)
The friend zone for males is where you end up when you don’t know what you are doing.
If make a move quickly enough, you will NEVER end up in the friend zone, you might get rejected and not get laid, but it’s better than wasting time for a couple months, sending texts and going on “dates”
The entire time the female thinks you are completely aware that you are both just friends, all the while you are waiting for the right time to “make your move” when the right time was on the very first, or maybe 2nd date.
If I feel the moment is right, I will kiss on the first date, in fact I usually do.
Basically my recipe for getting laid within one date is
1) Take them to a high end supper club, have a light meal and cocktails
2) head off to somewhere a bit more loose, get some more drinks in.
3) once we are both tipsy, go in for a kiss, if shes into it and we’re kissing passionately, invite back to my house.
4) get my end wet
5) never call again or return calls
6) repeat the next Friday or Saturday night with new girl
I’ve simplified all the bullshit from pick up artistry into the most condense form of dating to get laid as soon as possible, and works 70% of the time for me, Took me a while to learn the social cues, and i’m certainly not perfect, but I stopped caring about rejection.
I’m not rich, or particually good looking, it’s all about timing and reading the moment.
Sat 19 Feb 11 (12:02am)
I TOTALLY agree with you Bev. I have to build trust with the guy before I can be intimate with them. And the only way to do that is to be friends with them first.
I guess you will find out if a guy is “just” a friend or more by being friends with them first and getting to know them in a platonic way. I also think that by being friends first, you’re more likely to get to know a person on a deep level because there is no pressure (to impress).
For me, a guy will be in the “friend zone” if I don’t or can’t imagine being intimate (or sexual) with them. Also, if their personality is so incompatible to mine. I think you need a balance of personal and sexual compatibility.
I don’t have scientific studies to back this up… just personal experiences
I’ve got a golden ticket. I’ve got a golden chance to make my way.
There it is ladies and gents. The elusive chemistry. I’ve always found it amusing which guys hot girls have chemistry with.
Situation 1
“Here, I got you flowers and we have a table over there. What would you like for dinner?” He asks with quant trepidation, treating her as an equal.
“Thanks,” She says disingenuously, eyeing the exit.
NO CHEMISTRY
Situation 2
“What up biatch?” He asks with the arrogance of a twenty-year-old French goalkeeper.
“You’re an hour late.”
“Thanks mum.”
“Well do you want to get a table?”
“Whatever.” His phone breaks into I’m Two Sexy. He answers. “What’s up biatch, yeah I can be there in a bit just have a business dinner on at the moment. Don’t think it’s going to go too well.” He eyeballs his date, she gazes back foaming at the mouth in animal lust.
CHEMISTRY
Let’s do a little truth dealing. Hot girls (the only ones worthwhile sleeping with) only get a tropical storm front moving through their downstairs fantasy island when the object of their affection is out of their reach. Like pugs or toddlers they require teasing to keep them interested. Fail to tickle the feminine wiles, you’re a friend chump. And is there anything more soul destroying than tuning the object of your affection like a deranged pianist with his first electric guitar, only to have her utter the words, “Let’s just be friends”?
And make no mistake. She doesn’t want to be your friend. She wants you to crawl into a shallow grave and cover yourself with cold earth. There is no such thing as friendships between heterosexual men and women. There are men that like women that don’t like them back and vice versa. If a man regularly hangs out with a woman, he wants to bounce on her like a Bonobo after a pound of fermented peaches. And if you see some gawky flat footed thing shuffling its ballet flats around behind you in the office guys, it’s time to tell her, “I don’t want to be friends, I just want you to disappear.”
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:57am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:50am)
Is there no middle ground between wuss and dickhead then? Does it have to be one or the other???
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:05am)
I just wrote a huge reply to this but I must have done a type on the e-mail addy so it rejected it and didn’t keep everything I typed.
It was along the lines of - don’t be so bitter towards hot women, we’re not all bitches that go for bad guys and something about women liking male company more because females suck and are bitchy and whatnot and then I said something about women being more likely to put men in the friendzone because men will give anything a crack as long as it has a vagina and don’t lie because I’ve heard some nasty stories from my male mates.
Yeah I think that covered pretty much all of what I initially said!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:45am)
Bahahahaha…
Sadly, much of this is true…
Although, I will say that for a woman who is more ‘clued in’ and after something real, the guy in the second scenario would wear thin pretty quickly.
I couldn’t imagine actually sleeping with someone like this.
I think there is a way that guys (and girls) can not be relegated to the ‘friend zone’ but without acting like a jerk…
That is - act like you are a prize worth having (genuine confidence and self worth, not arrogance), be genuinely in touch with your own sensitivity, and bestow genuine care and affection on those you feel deserve it one they have proven they are worthy of your time and attention.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:02pm)
raz, it’s the same difference between hotty and notty.
You either inflate the chest and get a glimmer in your eye or you spend the rest of your life on the couch passing some selfish cow tissues while she unloads all her problems to you. You know the problems her moronic, insight-deficient choices lead her to.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (12:15pm)
Lulu, most (99%) of the hot women I’ve encountered have had the creativity and foresight of a squirrel frozen in carbonite.
I love how any criticism immediately makes one bitter. As if a pretty face earns you a lifetime of weak compliments and longing gazes. Wait it does. But not here sister.
Lulu, women put men in the friend zone because they are either at or below their level of attractiveness. Women always trade up. A dopey model who needs to read the back of a pack of Two Minute Noodles to know how long to cook them is trading up when she beds an obese billionaire.
Excuse us if men think someone who thinks TMZ is gospel, gleaming stilettos are a weekly must have and The Black Eyed Peas invented music is pretty much a walking billboard for the superficiality of modernity with a vagina attached.
Define oxymoron. Self aware hotty.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (02:09pm)
Just sayin, if it’s a choice between the 2 it’s a bit of problem for someone who’s not attracted to either
I know. Lesbianism is the answer. Well, if I thought women would be any easier to date anyway....
Fri 18 Feb 11 (03:19pm)
Sad Sad Reality - Your scenarios are so unrealistic. If I was spoken to in that manner (situation 2) I would be out the door in an instant.
I think you actually need a Reality Check… I cannot fathom how you think a decent female with any self respect would find that to be attractive or lead to wanting a second date. And if a female wants to be treated like that then she’s not worth the hassle, unless you are looking for a doormat.
I hope your perception of women is not the only “type” you have met; you may need to change your surroundings because believe me that is definitely not the case.
... Or you just enjoy aggravating others… either way, it is a sad sad reality.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (03:51pm)
Actually SSR - I don’t think it has anything to do with attractiveness. You contradict yourself in saying:
“women put men in the friend zone because they are either at or below their level of attractiveness”
then go on to say:
“ trading up when she beds an obese billionaire.”
I agree when you say women like to trade up, but I think that applies to both men and women (majority not all). But I don’t think attractiveness has anything to do with being put in the friendzone. As I said in another response - I think there’s a window and once it’s closed you’re in the friendzone. I’ve also seen people get out of the friendzone and have a successful relationship! So the friendzone is not the be all and end all either (for some)!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:46pm)
Lulu, reread my post. If a woman really likes a guy, it is generally because he is better looking, more powerful, more successful, more famous or more wealthy than herself. The same women “freind” any man at or below their level. This is why high school girls seldom date in their year and why 22-year-old secretaries think they have a shot with captains of industry.
Thanks. I needed a chuckle.
EK,
I have a few female friends. Most of them I’ve slept with. Sorry, all of them I’ve slept with. Which makes things awkward for my chick.
I keep these friends at arms length, because I don’t want to keep listening to them complain about their aches and pains all the time, whether it’s about work, family, money or love. Boring. I’d rather help a mate through an unfortunate moment.
I can’t seem to understand why every good looking chick I meet doesn’t want to play starfish with me, so I figure there’s no point in having chicks like that as friends.
Seriously, are you going to sit at home and watch football with a chick friend? No, because all she’ll do during the game is talk about shopping and cleaning products, or want to go to the beach.
Will a chick want to get blind with my mates while playing pool and discuss all the ways women impact on men’s lives? No.
Are chicks knowledgable about sport? No.
Can chicks go through a week without crying? No.
Can chicks drink with a bunch of friends without getting jealous/upset/crying? No.
EK,
My point is this: Why be friends with chicks? There is not one benefit they can bring to friendship that a man doesn’t offer.
Men have mates to get away from chicks.
I can’t understand why a man would want to surround himself with chicks who won’t give him a BJ.
Great friends with the opposite sex is a neat way of saying she won’t boof me. And if a man already has a chick, then there’s no vacancies.
I love women, lots of them, and some are considered friends.
But they’re hopeless friends, in comparison to my mates.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:20am)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:45am)
Are chicks knowledgeable about anything outside their desires?
Women - the subjective sex.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:54am)
Nearly pissed myself laughing at this IM.
Good way to start a Friday!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:12am)
“Are chicks knowledgable about sport? No.”
I actually gasped as I read this… Such a narrow view ironmike…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (11:17am)
I miss playing pool :( There no pool hall near my place. Got to head into the city, or Tulla.
Drinking and playing pool with mates was a weekly occurance a couple of year back. But then the place i went to closed, and then i moved, and it hasnt happened since.
And last years grand final sucked. Of all the teams to win....my sister is still banging on about that bloody game.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:16pm)
Do chicks know about sport? Ummm, yes.
A couple of weeks ago, I went with my girl friend to the pub to watch UFC. She’s absolutely loves it… Boxing and Muay thai too.
Me, I’m not don’t follow UFC too closely, but I do follow AFL, Soccer, Cricket, Tennis, and both forms of Rugby.
Girls that know sport do exist!
Mon 21 Feb 11 (11:44am)
Blindsie, does she think Anderson Silva showboats too much? Does she like how the Iceman makes it all about the stand-up or is she more interested in a Joe “Daddy” Stevenson style choke out?
It’s the details that tell.
For guys wing-people are the ultimate accesories and some are better than others.
1. A hot chicky (one that is obviously man-hunting as well is best)
2. A hot bloke (but he must defer to you)
3. 1 or more moderate looking chicks but no motre than 3 or 4 and maybe 1 other bloke
Blokes should never hang in groups of more than 2 because then it becomes a “pack”.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (09:48am)
Some girls like having only guy friends for many of the same reasons.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:19am)
This is how a guy gets to be “friend zone” rather than “potential hookup”
-I am not attracted to them
-they speak to me like they would their guy mates ie not flirtatious
-they talk about other girls to me
-they are a friends boyfriend/ex/a friend of my ex
I’ve gotten myslef into the friend zone a few times with guys ive been intested in and I think where I’ve gone wrong is I’ve tried to be too much like “one of the boys” and relate to them on their level. I’ve made some amazing friends this way and I get along with guys great, but I’ve learned that if I am actually intersted in someone I have to be a bit more feminine/girly/flirty to avoid the dreaded friend zone!
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:27am)
Sat 19 Feb 11 (03:13am)
Yes. For a girl, the best thing you can do is be feminine and girly.
Do NOT try to be one of the boys. Do not swear or act crass. Men are attracted to femininity. Act feminine like nature intended and you´re halfway there.
Truthfully, the friend zone is where someone is put once someone realises they are just not as much ‘into’ the friend.
I think the ‘lets just be friends’ comes when you are no longer a potential partner, but the person is nice enough to try and ‘let you down easy’.
For women, they ‘friend zone’ men, so they have someone (they don’t see as a potential partner) to vent all their frustrations/resentments/sadness (from other guys) to, and the men, hope that one day, magically a light will switch on and they will get to sleep with the woman.
Simply put, being a ‘friend’ or not is the difference between i want to be with you and you are not going to be with me, but i don’t want to hurt your feelings.
That’s the case of a woman’s desire to have something out of reach.. Also the jealousy plot line. When a guy has a hot female friend (that does want him), it means to other women that he has some traits that are desirable, and it turns on other girls.
From experience, one possible way to get out of the friend zone, is to stop being on a woman’s leash (don’t drop everything to do something FOR them), say NO sometimes. Also the BEST line, when told, lets just be friends, “i don’t want to be your friend (you really don’t, you do want to shag them...).
The End.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:59am)
What puts them into the friend zone.
- They are fat
- They have little penis’
- They are flat out ugly
- Still live at home
- No job
- No good in the sack
- No good at giving head or won’t do it
- Can’t cook
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:14pm)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:50pm)
i can agree with some of your list Flossy - but why is the ability to cook so important???
that would rule out a hell of a lot of ‘people’ women included.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (02:42pm)
Out of curiosity, how could you know any of:
- They have little penis’
- No good in the sack
- No good at giving head or won’t do it
If they were already in your friend zone?
Fri 18 Feb 11 (03:20pm)
You would be like Elaine from Seinfeld, friends with George, who “is unemployed and lives with his parents”.
You realise that this is a blog about being put/putting in the friend zone, not strickly what you find not attractive in a partner. Or do you think the friend zone is just what you say to someone who you’re not interested in?
My question Flossy, if you dated and found out they had one of those characteristics, would you still want to genuinely be their friend?
Fri 18 Feb 11 (03:55pm)
What if I can cross out 5 of your list…
Do I still end up in the friend zone?
BTW how are you going to know they have a little dick, no good in the sack or wont go down without dating and romping them first…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (03:56pm)
No what puts guys into the friend zone is this one and only thing.
BEING TO NICE
Fri 18 Feb 11 (05:17pm)
Well Flossy, I might just be what you’re after..
- They are fat - 6ft tall and 80kgs
- They have little penis’ - 8inches (thank you God
- They are flat out ugly - look like actor Martin Donovan (look it up)
- Still live at home - mortgage on own townhouse
- No job - been working 10 years in IT
- No good in the sack - described as ‘pretty damn good when you wanna be’
- No good at giving head or won’t do it - love doing it
- Can’t cook - no masterchef, but know my way around a kitchen enough to cook healthy meals.
I tell you what, you better be a right stunner though Flossy, being as picky as you are.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (05:42pm)
Sounds like SSR…
Fri 18 Feb 11 (07:54pm)
When I was single, I had been on a few dates with some eligible bachelors (and Women) and have found out a few of those above things, either by, yes having sex (shock horror). That promptly put them in the friend zone.
I didn’t realise that not being a Supermodel I’m not allowed to pick and choose whom I date. How silly of me. I’m not fat, above average looking, Smart, can construct a coherent sentence and like to have a healthy debate on the worlds issues. Why can’t I be picky too?
Lucky for me, my Husband has all the above qualities which made me marry him.
Gigi, because I enjoy cooking and I would like to have at least that in common with them.
Markus, because I like to have sex. I may have taken one home once or twice, so what? We both knew what we were there for and I was single at the time.
Nathan, why wouldn’t I want to be their friend? Just because they don’t “do” it for me on a sexual level, dosen’t mean I don’t want to have anything to do with them.
Baz, perhaps there is such a thing as being too nice, ie bending over backwards for the Woman of your desires too much and being too available.
Wow Gary, how can I refuse an offer like that.............
Fri 18 Feb 11 (08:57pm)
Close, Socrates, but I have a job. I’m the undercover that arrested you for flashing those kids in the park.
Sun 20 Feb 11 (10:30am)
I almost pissed myself when I read this because you can easily reverse this, in the case of my ex
- She had small saggy breasts
- Loose vagina
- Average looking but charming
- Lived off Centrelink, but I’m not judgemental
- No job
- Average in the sack, barely able to give head
- Could burn rice
But back to the OP, I really don’t agree with the whole idea of ‘friends with benefits’, sure it’s fun, but it’s degrading to both parties and when one person develops feelings for the other.......and they aren’t returned........people get hurt.......badly
Forgot about this, and it has been said a billion times, but preselection is key. Women simply aren’t that socially independent. It’s one of the fall backs of basing your entire self-worth on the shape of your bum and the symmetry of your face. You become a 2D herd animal, easy to predict and even easier to lure. Me see man with hot woman. Hot woman like man. Me want to be hot woman. Me like man, me be hot woman.
Go to vegas. All a guy has to do is sustain some big wins on the craps table and the prostitutes come running. Then the normal women see the whores vying for the guys attention and it’s a universal bitch shield collapse. If women were any more predictable, channel Nine would give them a talk show.
Fri 18 Feb 11 (01:23pm)
Fri 18 Feb 11 (10:18pm)
SSR, if I came across you in the street, I’d punch you in the nose. You spew misogyny. I love that my reality is a dimension away from yours.
Mon 21 Feb 11 (09:36am)
A dimension away from actual reality.