How can you tell if he fancies you?

Of course he’ss unsure. I’ve had plenty of these dates in the past where you think they’re keen because of all the signs (good convo, no awkwardness, compliments, hints) and then no kiss, or any other closing move.

My advice is to suggest further plans in the very near future if you’re not going to mack on him.

He’s the clueless one? Heheh. You didn’t want to kiss him and then you wondered why he thought you weren’t keen?

What did you do to let him know that you were interested? Did you assume the ‘charged’ atmosphere was enough?

I’d suggest touching the guy, smiling and holding eye contact when he says something you like. Rinse and repeat and you will rarely run into this problem again. Assuming you actually want him to kiss you anyway.

But why would he send me a message in the next day or two (when I texted him saying, hey while you’re here let’s go out again soon) going, “Ok, thanks for taking me out and being my buddy”?

That killed it for me.

Turquoise- Are you not listening? Because he probably thought you were just after a friend.

Guys do not want to seem like the nice guy friend that ends up wanting more.

You need to be explicit with guys if you want them to think you’re not just being nice.

By Stealth,

Actually I did assume the ‘charged’ atmosphere was enough… for that night anyway. I assumed we could go out again…

Plus I wanted him to show that he was interested.... mind you, he was touching me a bit… hmmm.

I guess in this situation I was a bit more stand offish than usual as he seems to have a knack for talking to the opposite sex and women seem to ‘respond’ quite quickly to his signals of interest (I’ve known this person as a ‘friend’ for a while).

So I suppose I was trying to separate myself from the herd by not falling too easily under his spell…

Turquoise

When we’re interested we’ll talk to you or find some way of getting you to notice us.

This doesn’t mean we also can’t be interested in other women. We can be.

We also don’t want to end up in the Friend Zone so we’ll try to play is cool. We also don’t want to come on too strong.

Plus I wanted him to show that he was interested.... mind you, he was touching me a bit… hmmm.

There’s your interest. With regards to seperating yourself from the herd, you’re talking about a kiss, not sleeping with him. Also, you’ll naturally stand out as the right choice if you’re both really compatible. Only idiots will move on from a girl that they’re really compatible with after sleeping with them.

And Charlie is spot on as usual. We’re allowed to be interested in more than one woman at once. Most single people whether men or women have a list of ‘potentials’ at any one time.

So after all the good quality feedback you’ve had, Turquoise, who would you say is responsible for things not going further?

So you played hard to get, wouldn’t kiss him, didn’t correct him when he called you a ‘buddy’, and you’re surprised he didn’t chase you to the ends of the Earth to prove his love for you?

And HE’S clueless?

Well… congratulations for not falling under his spell.

I’m very confused about women right now.

Explaining my current situation; a girl I quite like, lets call her Miss X, has become single recently. Now I understand that time is a factor to heal the long relationship she just came out of. Something which I am giving her.

In the mean time, I have been speaking with a married couple who are my close friends in regards to this. Mainly the wife of their relationship, let’s call her Mrs Advice, to get a woman’s understanding and insight.

Now, I have had lunch with Miss X on numerous occaisions. Picking up on subtle signals - playing with her hair whilst talking to me. However, Miss X has, on numerous occaisions had one nighters with randoms, and quite a few FWBs it seems. I can understand this - fulfilling a single girls needs, as much as a guys. Except it is a million times easier for women, being that you ultimately are the ones who give it a go ahead or not.

Moving on. These signals, are only being picked up on, because advice is being given to me on women’s bahviour. Outside of these signals, I simply have no inclination of whether a women likes me, or not.

I used to be young and naiive, and just say to a girl that I liked, I like you. But apparently, you all get put off by that. Instead, I have to have hourly long discussions and analysis of step by step every conversation and interaction I have had with Miss X, with Mrs Advice who is assisting me.

Her advice is that she is testing and informing me of these escapades because she likes me, and wants to gauge a reaction of jealousy for suitor purposes.

I said to Mrs Advice - why do women play these games? Her response “It’s not a game”.

Well ladies, I have news for you all - it really isn’t a game you’re playing, it’s an f’ing Olympic sport. Because I am simply clueless, and do not like playing mind games or coy or hard to get.

It doesn’t make a relationship better, it just makes you loose out on them, and then you sit there wondering why.

I’m a simple person, if you like me, say so. Or at least appreciate the fact if Im honest about liking you.

It really isn’t a mystery why romance is dying ladies - you’re killing it with your olympic sports.

@ ByStealth & Charlie

I would have to agree there are at least 3 guys that I am currently ( for lack of a better word ) crushing on. One of which i am currently testing the waters with.

Awesome,

I can’t think of a better case-study for this blog.

Guy: I like this girl, go out to dinner with her, things are going well.
Girl: I like this guy, just got out of a relationship so i’ll act a little standoff-ish at dinner. Atmosphere was great can’t wait to see him again.
Guy: Why is she acting so standoff-ish? Guess she just wants to be friends. Oh Well.
Girl:I can’t believe he didn’t read all my signs. He’s clueless. Oh Well.

This one was 100% your fault. Should have kissed him.

If you want to save the situation you’ll have to be very clear cut and forward that you’re ‘interested’ when you interactact with him moving forward. You don’t have to openly say it but some heavy flirting and touching would be a must.

Turquoise, you truly are one of the great comedians of our age. Below is a wonderful example of your clear-headed awesomeness.

Aaaah a topic close to my heart…(more like my erogenous zones)

I had a guy like this in my life. (The thought of him still makes me quiver)

We went out one night, lot of chemistry (he ignored me, belittled my outfit and said he was very picky who he went out with)… didn’t kiss (*Insert insane list of emotional responses that oscillate faster than atoms in the Large Hadron Collider*) but at the end of the night I felt really quite good. (I was frothing at the mouth with animal lust)

Then the next day he texted me going, “Thanks for taking me out and being my ‘buddy’.” I was like.. “Oh, ok, he wants to be mates… fair enough.” I was a bit cut (I cried like a baby, inhaled three tubs of double choc ice cream and bought another cat)

THEN I found out weeks later, after he’d gone back to his city, that at the TIME he told a mutual friend that that particular night he’d felt particularly sexually/emotionally attracted to me ("Dude I could’ve totally banged her aye.") that the atmosphere was ‘charged’ ("She was gagging for it.") for HIM, but that he didn’t think I was ‘feeling it’ ("She wasn’t hot enough to go there but") so he didn’t do anything. He completely mis-read it. (Read it like See Spot Run)

So now maybe I think the ‘buddy’ message the next day might have been more a statement to test whether I really did think he was just a buddy or not...? ("I called her buddy in a message to mess with her. Chicks love when you mess with them. Especially the ugmos")

He’s clueless…(I’ll tear his clothes off the next time I see him. Where are all the good men?)

OK, thanks team...

Now the real question is…

What now?

I am now ‘free’ to pursue this, and will shortly catch up with this person, however I am unsure of his current relationship status now…

Banicks, it can be very frustrating for men, but women test.

They will test you to make sure that you are actually who you say you are and that you’re an emotionally strong man. It’s just how the world works and you need to get used to it.

Yes, this girl is testing you to see if you have a problem with her being a sexually liberated woman. If you do, you’ll do something to show you’re jealous. If you don’t, you’ll just act cool, escalate on her and try to get her back to your bedroom.

Personally I don’t care if a woman has other guys in her life because I know that at the end of the day if I’m the one for her, all the other guys will disappear.

Plus its hypocritical for me not to preach what I practice

@Turquoise

If you are getting a second date, just go with the flow. Don’t over analyse. You will both know if it feels right.

@Banicks

I wouldn’t bother on Miss X, she’s clearly not in the right frame for a relationship. However if want a gauge, return her medicine, tell her of her of your awesome night out with swedish backpackers. If she doesn’t like it, then she likes you.

Damn Banicks you are not simple!
Tell the girl you like her, If she is put off by that, then she isn’t worth it.

I’m a straightforward girl, no games, if someone likes me they let me know and its damn obvious, I decide if I like them (to not be sexist its vice versa as well)and if so, We are together.

I dont understand all these games and rules others play by.

Banicks, this girl is effectively warning you off her. She telling you, she is a mad slut and not relationship material.

Hit and quit it if you must, but don’t get serious with her.

Why is HE clueless? when you’re the one who went into the date feeling all apprehensive and thinking how all inappropriate it is. I think he picked up and the clues quite well, and typically female blame the male for picking up what you are putting down.

And what if I got on this ‘date’ and he has a girlfriend now?

Unless you get a vibe that what he is after is platonic, I think its irrelevant what other girls he has in his life. If he likes you he might just proceed as normal regardless.

It’s up to you whether you’ll accept him seeing other girls besides you.

Personally I’d be fine with it, with the expectation that the other girls would disappear when things got serious, but that’s me and my low levels of jealousy.

I don’t have a solution, but I admire your problem.

Hey Turquoise- If you go on the date and he’s got a girlfriend it means you lost your chance because he thought you weren’t keen.

Just think of it as a lesson learned not to be so standoffish with a guy you like in future.

If he doesn’t mention the girlfriend, subtley make it come up.

Yea, I’ve given up already with her.

Got better things to do with my time than play silly mind games.

Hey turquoise, I’ll admit straight away that I have 0 dating experience, but I’m 99% sure that (assuming it hasn’t been a long long time since you saw him last) saying “oh, hey, what have you been up to lately?” will give you the answer you want.  If he has a gf now then he’ll probably go “oh, I met this lovely girl etc” (since he’ll be excited about it) or he’ll go “not much” (nothing as exciting as you anyway ).  I’m sure you won’t have too much trouble fitting that question in.

So what?

My V8 Jaguar averages 9.1l/100km and doesn’t shake the teeth out of your head.

How cool!

Manual/Auto transmission?
Cruise Control on?
Windows up/down?
Aircon on?

Oh Ek, how I wish your advice were true. I used to share your rosey opinion. And yes, I’m aware women never tell a guy straight up.

Oh, and trust me- some people are just stupid. They just say the first thing that cmes to mind, which has no indication on their interest.

I once had a woman straddling me/sitting on top while making out and, in a break in the kissing, mentioned being in a similar position with her ex.

That was the end of that for me. No thank you.

So in terms of your friend, she should probaably ask him straight out if she didn’t get a final answer before. As a guy, I don’t mind answering that question. Done it before, would do it again.

Smidgeling I really think you are quite a sweetheart.

Sorry about your recent dark times with the opposite sex.

Smidgeling is right.

If we talk to you or show any interest whatsoever then we’re interested.

The level of interest may vary, however. This will be related to relative leagues as Smidgeling suggested. I’ll be a lot more interested in a Victoria’s Secret model than the dowdy bookworm in the corner. I’ll try a lot harder with the VS model than the dowdy bookworm, too.

@ Charlie

That bookworm in the corner could be a VS model in disguise

Yes Smidgeling I hope you are right: if a man really likes you he will tell you. I also think for women it’s all about listening to what a man is really saying. At some point you want a man to have the courage to say what his intentions are.
I disagree with those who told Turquoise off for not showing more interest/affection. In my book it’s best to let the man make the moves.
My advice Smidgeling?
1. Say nothing if you are unsure.
2. If you are sure put your hand on hers and say: I really like you.
3. If you really like a girl make the dates interesting, fun and build up the touching/kissing. Show her that she matters by taking the time. Open communication is best. Many guys would benefit greatly from asking straight out how the woman feels about them. However, I think women should not ask the question but should listen and watch very carefully. Sometimes it’s about timing, too, so trust that if it’s right it will somehow work out.
It’s a bloody jungle but that’s the sense I can make out of it.

I’ve experienced quite the opposite actually.

For the longest time, I was in serious infatuation with a very introverted fellow who was part of my friendship circle. We flirted a lot. We shared a few in-jokes. A couple of friends commented that we seemed to really like one another. I constantly waited for him to ask me out beyond our friendship circle. He never did. So I confessed my feelings to him; and he responded in a very confusing manner saying he’d be up for dating but don’t expect too much from him. Subsequently from that email (email because I’m an introvert as well and it physically hurt anytime I thought about telling him in person), there was a lot of flirting. But every time I asked him to hang out, he’d not reply or decline. And he never asked me out.
I got so sick of the mindgames I was going through and his lack of directness (i.e., if he wasn’t interested in me, why didn’t he just say so?) I just confronted him, asked him if he saw me as more than a friend, to which he declined (after I had asked for total and honest truth) and I gave up on pursuing anything further. We stopped flirting almost instantly. He stopped showing the little things that showed he cared. The sudden change was bizarre because doing all the little flirting and whatnot was the way that I would show my interest, and it seemed it was his tactic as well.

Looking back on it, I truly can’t tell if he was interested in me or not because of the mixed signals and lack of crystal clear direction.

I’ve also had a fellow, with a reputation for attracting a lot of women, talk constantly about how hot his secretary is and how much money he’s making, and this girl that he met on OKCupid that was really into him (and he not so much) and so on and so forth in front of me in a group situation. According to another member of the group, he was posturing in front of me to show off how much of a “catch” he was, in the hopes I would bite. He was interested in me, but refused to chase, preferring to be the chased. I thought he was cute, but that was it. Actually, his posturing provided the reverse effect - I scratched him off the potential dating list because so many women were apparently into him, and I don’t like competition and feeling like the man is the “prize.”

My current boyfriend, however, has his heart on his sleeve and it was just blatantly obvious he was falling quickly head-over-heels for me. In this case, yes, it was very direct that he was into me.

There’s still a part of me that wonders if I could’ve done anything different with the first guy.

Merry- No, the first guy was just looking for an ego boost, hence the “don’t expect too much” that you got from him.

You asked him and got an answer.

Turquoise- I know you mean well, but being called ‘a sweetheart’ is like a sentence to the nice guy dungeon! Yuk.

I agree with your last line. Some women appear like ‘ice queens’ but are really just nervous. Guys can’t tell the difference.

EK - sometimes you have to crule to be kind.

Asking the guy flat out will not work in your favour 100 percent of the time.

On any date forcing the hand of the other party by asking them ‘Do you like me’ will result in a no unless they have already made their mind up that they like you.

If you’re prepared to give the flick to guys sitting on the fence then this might not be an issue.

@ByStealth

fair call. I am not saying I do this after the first date, I mean i give it time for even myself to gauge where things are going and if i start getting the idea that the feeling isnt mutual then i dont mind getting on to the “ so whats the go here” (generally not put so crudely though ) converesation.

Yeah, that makes a lot more sense. It’s much more appropriate to do it that way after a bite of time. I would only do it as a last resort too.

I’ve had these sorts of phonecalls where I’m about to walk away because I think she’s not into me, but then she’ll let me know that she is actually keen. Meeting her afterwards I’ve found her to be much more forward about letting me know where she stands (touching etc).

That ‘whats the go’ conversation does have its place.

Nah EK, not a hardened witch,.. nothing of the sort.

It was just the way the blog was written.  Sounded a bit too much like that other one (’shudder’).

I have always maintained that the best girls are the ‘simple sally from next door with at least one brother’,… feminine with a little bit of tom-boy!
Know what i mean?!

Spot on Tim. Words are your friend with a man. He’s not going to flick his hair back like a loreal model to show he’s keen.

I’d totally like to think you’re right Tim, that guys really are all that upfront and know what they want.

The thing is, I have had two guys I was at uni with tell me at social/work functions a couple of years out of uni that they were completely into me at uni. They never said or did anything to show that. Just lusted from afar. So I’m confused by that.

Maybe it’s the youthful thing: young guys aren’t that sure of themselves, but once you grow up you get organised and confident.

Not all guys Bitten.

With respect to your Uni thing, I’m betting that the guys did things to show you that they liked you, but you’d already put them in the “friend” zone and didn’t notice.
It’s an easy trap to fall into.

If guys are calling you up, inviting you to stuff and generally hanging around you often, They like you.

You are correct though, that it’s often harder when you’re younger because rejection can be harder to take.
My comment to use verbal communication more is directed at both men and women, It would solve thousands of relationship problems instantly.

You’re a rare one Tim. The main reason why I stopped dating was because guys would not shut up about their ex/other women on the date.

It truly is the ultimate turn off for me.

Yep. There isn’t anymore to it.

If you just want to be friends with a guy, just say it before you go out with him and pay for your own coffee or meal if he still wants to go ahead with it.

Yep. There isn’t anymore to it.

If you just want to be friends with a guy, just say it before you go out with him and pay for your own coffee or meal if he still wants to go ahead with it.

Ironmike....you must be single as you deserve to be single.  What a sexist pig!

Or alternatively, that attitude is worthy of the “redness, tingling and burning anywhere in your underpants” - be careful what you wish for cos you might just get it!

Generally speaking I agree, but if a guy asks you out seemingly casually for a dinner or ‘catch up’ and you go,

“Yes I’ll go out with you but only as a friend,” doesn’t that seem a little… presumptuous?

For the majority of men it’s Women = girlfriend. Men = mates. However I know a man with a number of women friends who he catches up with like this. He’s not sleeping with all of them.

Some men are just more ‘women friendly’ than others.

And if so, how do you distinguish whether he’s asking you out as a friend or as a potential lover?

I find THESE kinds of men, ‘women’s men’, the MOST confusing type of all. Because they are not as simple to work out as the rest.

They are a difficult and rare breed who are usually more sensitive…

I find THESE kinds of men, ‘women’s men’, the MOST confusing type of all. Because they are not as simple to work out as the rest.

Some of the best operators I know are like this. No-one knows exactly who he’s sleeping with because he’s so flirty and touchy feely with everyone.

Good work that man.

Anyway, if a guy is asking you out and you’ve already classified him as a friend, it’s not presumptuous at all to tell him you’ll go as friends. It lets him know where he stands.

If the girl is still on the fence she won’t say anything. If she decides mid date that she isn’t keen, many men will unfortunately misinterpret that as her leading him on.

Basically there are no guarantees for either party that it’s going to happen until it’s pants dance time.

Turquoise- I’m sort of one of those guys still. I have my male “mates” and some female friends.

The difference is clear- he’ll probably ask you out to a more intimate situation before you’re what most people would deem an established friend. Or he’ll show signs like the ones you desccribed in your post above.

You know what you could do to figure it out? Ask, ‘where do we stand with each other?’

I was going to write my own reply but this is pretty much everything I was going to say.

It’s really not hard ladies…

Smidge,

Don’t you think blurting out, “Where do we stand with each other??”

is a bit full on too early on in the piece...?

We’re talking about the first few dates here…

and FYI, this ‘woman’s man’ I’m referring to IS THE SAME guy I mentioned in my original post, the one I went to dinner with…

Which makes him even more of an enigma…

GEEZ
How are you supposed to know if you want to have sex/develop a relationship with someone unless you get to know them first.. ie by going on coffee/lunch/dinner with the person?!!

Turquoise- Obviously you’re unsure if it’s a date with guy that might want to jump your bones or just a friend. So no, it’s not too early to ask something to the effect of- are we just friends or are you after more? In fact, it’s better to find that out straight away.

Soso- The implied constant here is that you know this person to a certain degree. Like a workmate or friendd of a friend.

However, at a base level we are debating how to figure out if someone is OPEN to perhaps haaving a relationship/physical fling with you.

We’re trying to figure out how people like Turquoise can avoid the flat out rejections without missing a potential yes.

Yep… trying to work out if he might want more OR if he’s just a mate, this is true.

And there is, of course, the added complication that he may now have a girlfriend…

So we’re not allowed to get to know a prospective partner.  Is it truly that unreasonable that sex is left to the second third or even possibly god help us all FOURTH date?!  If I’m really considering somebodys long term company I think I would wait for at least 2 coffee dates before I let him show me how to unhook a bra and look at a pair of panties.

Seriously, who dates their friends?

Think about it.

Uuhhmmm- What part said people couldn’t wait to have sex? Ironmike is a man of saying things in extremes.

The whole point of this is trying to work out if they are recceptive to getting to know someone in that capacity.

I think most people with any measure of intelligence can tell this thread, and the blog at large, is about trying to avoid asking out people who wouldn’t even consider more than a platonic relationship.

Direct- I said friends OF FRIENDS. But I have dated a girl after being friends for a year and it worked out to be one of my longest relationships.

John - this cartoon is PERFECT for you!

Cute Boy On Train -

http://xkcd.com/642/

You just have to try…

Some girls will screen you out just because you don’t have the balls to ask the question. By being direct in asking a girl out you are subcommunicating confidence (attractive) and a willingness to take risks (also attractive).

Women are programmed to be attracted to men that can face the risks and dangers in the world and there’s no better way to show that then by putting your balls and emotions on the line by making the first move.

@ Turquoise
Comic very true. Guys way over analyse the situation.

@John
There’s nothing worse then not asking the person out, then finding out later they were ‘so into you’ but ‘X’ asked me out…

If they say no, its only awkward, if you make it awkward. It is better knowing then wondering what if?!

Trust me, when I was single in my early twenties I was too cautious for my own good…

can i also say that when he first messaged me thankign me for dinner and listening to him discuss his relationship stuff i said no problem, its always nice making a new friend.

So that makes it clear doesnt it?

Are you for Realz?

See Ironmike’s post above.

And a guy with a kid who’s just seperated from a gf/wife is probably looking for a rebound root.

Nicole

Just because this guy separated from his wife so recently, chances are he had separated from her a long time before that in both his heart and in the bedroom.  So the ‘new-ness’ is probably not worth worrying about.

But yes, I would say that this is either one of two things - he genuinely likes you and wants to make an effort to show you this, or you are simply the rebound root.

My spidey-sense is telling me its the former as opposed to the latter, but either way this guy wants to do some horizontal folk-dancing with you, and you do too.  And why the fuck not?

Yes its a date.

The use of the word ‘friend’ isn’t always the bomb people think it is. Sometimes you have to use the word consistently as once isn’t enough.

I’d ring him up and be honest by letting him know exactly where you stand (He’s not out of the running, but nothing would happen for a while). Don’t just jump into the subject, but make small talk and lead into it (common sense I know). Chances are he’d be happy with your honesty and put you on the back burner for a raincheck in 6 months.

He like you, or at least wants to bang.

Be clearer, some vague comment about making new friends doesn’t communicate anything but ‘you enjoyed his company’, thus you will potentially like him romantically.

It is a soft date, i.e. one that he can claim it’s not a date if being on a date with him makes you uncomfortable and provides some crumple zones for his ego.

Lol- you aren’t actually serious right? Of course it’s a bloody date.

Because we’re so used to girls playing it cool and letting us make the moves sometimes we take little hints of “just friends” to be playing hard to get.

Someone said “Smidgeling (obviously they used my real name) is cute” and they said “ew”. Turns out she had a massive crush and got embarassed at the confrontation. People are retarded.

can i also say that when he first messaged me thankign me for dinner and listening to him discuss his relationship stuff i said no problem, its always nice making a new friend.
So that makes it clear doesnt it?

No it does not.  This is a mixed message. 

The second he reads that message about “a new friend” he will be thinking that this is going to go nowhere (romantically) and cease making any efforts in that direction.

Then you will get all pissed off with “why has he stopped calling?” etc.  If you had no intention of taking things further with him you should have said so DIRECTLY.

For example: “Look guy, I like you, and these one-on-one moments we’ve had have been great, but I am not interested romantically” or “I like you, but I want to give you some space to deal with your separation, so you tell me when you are ready” or “Lets do some serious tummy slapping”.

That’s an easy one, yes.

thanks for the response guys, esp Eagles HAter and Bystealth.

Im pretty sure i present as the type of woman you have a relationship with, or date, o rbring home to your mum. I dont send out f$%^ buddy messages im pretty sure.

i do like him, i just wouldnt even consider it for at least 6 months.

im going to try talk to him to clear things up...awkward but hopefully the honesty comes across genuinely...dont want to come across as an ego-maniac, but youve all been pretty clear its a date.

thanks again

Don’t go to his place for dinner!  The invitation is a euphemism for asking for a root.

Make him bloody well work for it.  You don’t have to be stand offish to make him work, but he should.

UPDATE

so we were messaging yesterday, and i told him i thought he was a bit fabulous but im giving him 6 months space to deal with his ex, and he responds that its all in my head and hes just busy making friends and having fun and working.

boy do i feel like a d@#k.

Im glad i was honest and didnt lead him on, but now i just feel like a massive idiot.

I agree with Shane.

Go to dinner with him, but say you’ll go OUT to dinner with him, not go to his house.

You get some alcohol into you and our inhibitions will drop, which will be what he wants!

As a side note (for safety, as a girl) you really should NOT go to dinner at someone’s house for the first time without knowing them a little bit first and going on a few dates.

If things turn uncomfortable or he comes on way too strong and you decide you don’t want to be there, you’ll be at someone’s house, alone, and partially intoxicated. Not a good combination.

Be a little bit careful initially, particularly as he is probably DYING to have sex and may not have had it in months if he has just broken up with the ex.

Nicole,
what that guy told you is pure bullshit. Plain and simple.

He thought you would be up for a bit of bedroom action and that’s what the dinner invite was about.

Once you told him that you liked him but wanted to give him 6 months, he thought “there goes my chance for some easy sex”.
The “I’m just busy making friends and having fun and working” line is his way of getting out of the situation whilst making you think it’s your fault.

The guy is looking for casual sex. Once you were off the menu he doesn’t care any more.

Tim- I agree. Otherwise it would’ve been a dinner party with multiple guests. You know, so he has a group of friends like he claims he’s looking for.

If he wanted to make friends with just you a lunchtime coffee would be more convenient.

“I prefer to show it with my cations”

And if she shows you her anions, it’s chemistry!

Aah, geek humour! Always classic!

That’s a crock of shit Mike.

There are many women, such as myself, who feel VERY individual and strong when it comes to selecting partners and don’t care too much what our friends think.

If I selected based on what some of my friends thought was great, I’d pick a guy that was - rich, emotionally cold (in general), never home, high status.

Instead of what’s important - character, warmth, intelligence and the rest of it.

At the end of the day, your ‘friends’ aren’t sharing your life or your bed, so selecting people based on OTHERS’ TASTES is ridiculous.

It’s almost as bad as marrying someone largely because everyone in your family likes them and their family likes you.

Men are sheep too, I’ve found, in that way.

Very few people have the guts to carve out their own path…

That approach would never work with me mike j - if you show interest in my friends then I’m not gonna be interested in you!  It’s not a competition and I’m not going to compete with my own friends…

Nothing makes this girl wetter than whispering something in my ear and then walking away to let me process it on my own… Repeat step one and if I’m interested this will seal the deal!

Not to be harsh ladies, but mike j has a point. He’s speaking in generalities, but rules of thumb like his are what you operate by when you’re out at a nightclub. That’s because they work and if it doesn’t work on you, you’re more of an exception than the rule.

Also, the ‘bad boy’ school of pick up works best on younger girls 18-25 who are still choosing men at the pub based on instincts rather than common sense.

Funnily enough, girls 18-25 are the most physically attractive to men and when you’re looking for a one nighter, the pub/club is the best place to go.

If I’m meeting a professional girl in her late 20’s that I’ve met through mutual friends I wouldn’t use that approach and older girls are better at spotting games like that a mile off anyway.

Not to say that some girls fall for stupid things like this regardless of age…

Haven’t you girls heard of the expression the exception that proves the rule?

Lock in option B Eddy.

Unfortunately, Holly, as has been adequately explained above, any objective risk-management approach to pussy acquisition clearly favours the rule over the exception. It’s a shame you’re not the rule.

But I can only speak from personal experience. So if the guy you like is a nub who hasn’t figure women out yet, he’s probably just giving you mixed signals because you are Ingrid.

Why pussy-foot around the issue?  If neither of you said anything to eachother you would ended up not knowing what could have been. and a great deal of time and opportuntiy would have been wasted.

Life’s too short.  Get rejected?  Who gives a shit?  The sting goes eventually.

Your mate would be stoked if you went to him and asked him what he thoughts were.

If you’ve been to dinner he probably likes you. If you’ve been to dinner alone he definitely likes you.

Guys like to play it cool because coming on too strong is apparently the worst thing in the world and we hate rejection.

I can’t help you in regards to girls continually rescheduling on you - I think that is pretty form (if repeated). I’ve never done it, but my housemate (who is a guy) has girls do it to him sometimes. But I think he dates some pretty precious Sydney clichés.

I agree that an easy, flowing conversation is usually a good sign that there is some kind of connection. But if it’s not flowing brilliantly, I don’t think that it necessarily means that the girl is disinterested. In can depend upon how chatty you are, or whether she is shy or nervous. When I’m comfortable with people I’m very talkative and opinionated (not judgemental), but naturally I’m an introvert, so can be a little… stilted (not the right word, but can’t think of it)when on a first date. So I might be little more awkward/uncomfortable, and may repeat a question.

To show a guy that I’m interested, I’ll probably smile and laugh a lot. And of course, with the guys that I get along with really well, the conversation does usually flow pretty easily.

But I think the moral of the story, is that there isn’t just one sign that you can use to read whether a person is interested.

There is no scientific formula to this. I learned from dating, that one needed to be proactive, lead (but willing to change if needed) and not die wondering.

Its funny but guys sometimes forget that girls, especially ones you find atractive, can be as nervous as you are.

Sydney Princess’s. (lol). I was once visting and went out in Balmain, had a couple of very nice ladies approach me. In the conversation and off topic, I got asked what school I went to. Seriously. When you’re over thirty is that relevant?

ha ha. What school you went to?! That’s pretty bad. But I must admit, I’ve been asked that one a lot of times - usually by other girls! Oh, and by guys when I started an engineering degree. They all wanted to know what school everyone was from so they could stereo type everyone neatly. For better or worse I happened to attend one of the most disadvantaged and isolated schools in NSW, so there was no way to really dress it up, so I just own(ed) it.

Back on topic (well, slightly), I must admit that a guy leading is nice - it definitely clarifies whether a guy likes you or not.

When I was in one of my wittier moods I would try to deflect a silly query like ‘school’ with humour. I.E. ask them what shoe size they wear? ‘Whats that got to do with anything?’. More then you would imagine

What uni you went to is more asked by peers in your career then dates. Unless you are dating someone in the same industry. Which I will never do.

I had nothing to hide from either my school or university but its more fun not playing the ‘game’.

Incidently what are the big schools in NSW that would mean you are in the ‘club’?

Not really sure what the big schools in Sydney are… Scots College is about the only one that I can remember. It all means nothing to me when they tell me what private school they went to - I can’t tell one from another. I usually prefer other country kids that have moved to the city - less wank factor - particularly when it comes to guys.

But what school you went to is just the start. Living with a guy I’m starting to hear some of the horrors of dating some pretty precious girls. But, he does seem to keep going back to the same, stunning, but high maintenance kind of girl. So my sympathy is limited.

I know the type. If your housemate is letting them walk all over him in their 6 inch stilletto’s he’s a glutton for punishment.

Ask if you can bring a friend along. That makes it pretty clear its not a date.

As I said earlier, bottom line, ask.

I’d recommend asking him if he thinks it is a date, probably before the event.

Depending on his response, it will be enough reason to clarify your thoughts if neccesary.

It is better than letting him pine over something that isn’t going to happen.

If he hasn’t said anything it leaves him with his dignity but gives him a clear sign you aren’t interested romantically.

Go to the party, get drunk, hook up with some other guy and take that guy home and shag him. That should make it perfectly clear to your friend that you are just friends.

You either feel silly asking now or face the awkwardness of it later. It’s a choice you have to make. Upfront is always easer.

I just say, a girl did this before so I just want to check. Sometimes I’m wrong, but it’s better than being right and not nipping it in the bud.

I wish it was socially acceptable to just outright say to a guy you’ve just met ‘I’m interested in you and would like to meet up with you again to see if we could be romantically involved. Would you also like to do this?’ and then it’d be all over in a minute and there’d be none of this angst!!

But this is the point of the problem - men, like me, would find that sort of thing completely acceptable, not to mention, a complete relief.

Social boundaries have changed, and the social norms have to change along with it.

The only people who find that sort of thing socially unacceptable are the stuck-up princesses who think its all about “the chase” and the egoistic males.  Both are normally pretty easy to pick however.

Anja,

Why isn’t it socially acceptable? Maybe I am just a bit more relaxed about it than other guys, but I would have no problem if you did something like that. I have had lots of female friends that I have just been friends with after trying a date to see if we worked.

While I know most women prefer a leader, just ask him for a drink (not on a friday, too easy to mix it with work people too early). If he says yes he is interested, if he says he has something on, but doesn’t give a different day to go out he isn’t interested. If he doesn’t respond ... well you know.

FFS- he’s not playing any games. He contacted you afterwards playing it cool.

It’s YOUR expectations taking over. He’s just not an assertive guy. If you have that big an issue with it he’s not the guy for you, but he clearly likes you!

Be glad someone you find attractive is interested in you. Whinger.

Erm yeah thanks for the Whinger comment Smidgeling - i normally like and appreciate your posts - but calling me a whinger because i am open and upfront and dont like to be stuffed around with is a tad unfair.  I was glad to have had a nice time but negotiating contact afterwards should not be that hard - especially when the man is confident, assertive and knows you’re interested - FFS.  Wasn’t asking for a marriage proposal just a clear indication he was interested and not just being polite, and yes if a man is going to continue the i like you one minute then ignore you the rest of the time, then i can’t be bothered.  Clarity is something most people value.

For the record, I sent an sms asking if he wanted to catch up for a drink (funnily enough i did this before i read your advice Chaos) and got - no response.  So - obviously as mentioned above - no response is a clear indication of a negative.

Gigi,

He’s a shy bloke, he’s not playing games but he’s probably not particularly good at reading chick signs.

Be bold yourself.  Ask him out.  The worst he can do is say no.

I have to apologise if the comment offended- I was/am in a bad mood. It’s partly that it struck a nerve (some recetr experience makes me a little more standoffish with women) and partly that I think you should be more willing to take the lead.

I think your best bet is to ask if someone is keen straight out and if they don’t give you a clear answer they’re just there for the ego boost.

I actually think that the replies to Gigi’s comment actually illustrate how much of a grey area it is when trying to determine whether a guy/girl is interested.

Chaos said send another message - no response means he’s not keen.
Smidgeling suggested that he was keen - with all the same info as Chaos.

And it turns out that he’s not keen. He hasn’t responded to the messages Gigi has since sent suggesting a catch up. Unless he’s got some awesome excuse, he’s not keen enough.

So Smidgeling, to have suggested that it was OBVIOUS that he was interested in Gigi, and that it was her expectations ‘taking over’ is actually pretty unfair, and shows that’s it’s not as cut and dry as you made it out to be.

To Gigi,
He probably does like you, but perhaps not enough to pull his finger out and make something happen. And it doesn’t sound like you want to be pushing this ‘relationship’ along (and I agree, nor would I), so it probably is better just to cut him off - perhaps even tell him if you want. Sometimes I think it’s handy for people to be told, ‘I like you, but I feel like you’re stuffing me around, and not that interested, therefore, I won’t be calling any more’. As an aside, I did this to a guy that was stuffing me around once. He was kind of trying to turn me into a f-buddy, whereas I wanted either a relationship, or just a friendship. In the end I told him I didn’t even want to be friends. Think he was pretty shocked, and was all ‘but I think you’re awesome’ crap. What he didn’t seem to appreciate, was that he wasn’t being a good friend to me, and was using me as his personal ego boost. Who would want to be friends with someone like that?!

Firstly - thanks for the comments and perspectives—all very valid and good to ponder on.

Appreciate the second posting Smidgeling - i’ve kinda noticed some stuff you’ve mentioned so i’m sorry you’re somewhat disillusioned with women at the moment.  You seem to be an intelligent, well balanced guy who speaks his mind so i hope you find some better experiences.  Just be yourself, those who like your style will be attracted and those who are not well just not worth knowing I guess.

Bear - thanks so much for the astute words - highlights the problem that some people’s mode of communicating is not clear or upfront and hard to work out.  It’s only easy to know what you mean, and others can be difficult to interpret when they dont say what they mean or are hiding behind words or just being polite rather than honest. 

Will just stick to being my kinda introverted, bold and honest self - i’m sure at some point in time i’ll find someone who appreciates my boldness and cheeky, cute nerdy ways.

Til then there’s always chocolate!

Don’t think anymore of this guy Gigi. Find someone more deserving of your time.

If he didn’t respond to your SMS he’s definitly not interested. There’s a 1% chance his phone is out of credit or he got attacked by a new breed of flying super Monkey, but that is highli unlikley.

Sometimes a guy has to delay a response so he doesn’t appear too keen, or he genuinely has something else on, but I don’t think that’s the case here.